Diffs ??

Post by **pietpetoors** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:36 pm

I frequently see on forums that people prefer the imported diff on a Hilux above the gearmax diff. Why is this, is there problems with the Gearmax?

Post by **Family_Dog** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:53 pm

Piet,

Nothing really wrong with the Gearmax diffs, buit the general feeling is that the Imported diffs are stronger than the local ones. On the other hand, the local ones are much cheaper, and it is a lot cheaper and easier to fit a diff lock, if one wants to.

-F_D

BenHur · Post by **BenHur** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:22 pm

Imports are generally stronger with thicker side shafts and more splines on them. You can also only use a gearmax or a detroit diff lock on the local ones and with the imported ones there are many types to choose from.

Edit: ek is jammer ek het onduidelik geskryf, was al bietjie moeg gewees.

Disclaimer:
The writer of this post can not be held responsible for any confusion created by his ramblings after 8PM in the evening.
He will also not be responsible for any deaths or injuries that my result directly or indirectly as a result of anyone applying any advice contained of his posts.]

Knersus · Post by **Knersus** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:35 am

How about some pictures to show the different types

HiluxJunkie · Post by **HiluxJunkie** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:10 pm

Hi;

If I crawl under my van , how do I know which diifs do I have ?

BenHur · Post by **BenHur** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:11 pm

take a picture and we will tell you or read my confusing post above in which I explained.

BenHur · Post by **BenHur** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:21 pm

import

local

ThysdJ · Post by **ThysdJ** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:25 pm

I have import diff on the back of Kaspaas, but not as much mud on the spare wheel... 8)

:D

BenHur · Post by **BenHur** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:26 pm

Eric

check the difference in the arm connected to the LSPV. check the angle on Bulldog after I installed the 100mm longer shackles compared to Redbull where I added a piece into the adjusting screw.

Post by **CasKru** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:29 pm

Bennie... is that greasable shackles on the import picture?

BenHur · Post by **BenHur** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:30 pm

Kaspaas wrote:I have import diff on the back of Kaspaas, but not as much mud on the spare wheel... 8) :D

Jy sal nou laat Eric begin naels kou.

Nee wat dis nie so erg nie, dis eintlik al Klerksdorp se stof, toe Pretoria se reÃ«nwater en die kamera se flash om dit te aksentueer

BenHur · Post by **BenHur** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:35 pm

That is our prototype we made for Eric's van last week. I am having ones made today (I hope they get it done on a Friday afternoon) that will be greasable.

ThysdJ · Post by **ThysdJ** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:39 pm

BenHurBul wrote: Jy sal nou laat Eric begin naels kou.

Ek het gedog daar is dalk iets fout met Kaspaas :!:

Post by **Family_Dog** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 5:28 pm

Kaspaas wrote:I have import diff on the back of Kaspaas, but not as much mud on the spare wheel... 8) :D

The Mud Aerosol spray can was emptied on the spare, we never had enough to do the rest of the vehicle...

But don't worry: I have a brand new (unused) spare here at home. The spare that's on Bulldog is a "Marie-Biscuit" type, on a 16" rim. Forgotten the size, Bennie will have to crawl under and have a look. The reason for this is that with the LR tank, the correct spare hangs very low, it's a 31x105.x15 and is about 50mm or so wider than the "emergency" spare. I had it on for just one day and then changed the spare back to the 16" rim with narrow tyre. Overall, there is very little difference in overall diameter and it would get one home if it had to.

Edit: I think the tyre is a 245/75/16

Edit #2: Actually, might be 215/75/16.

-F_D

Post by **Family_Dog** » Sat Feb 02, 2008 8:17 am

BenHurBul wrote:Eric

check the difference in the arm connected to the LSPV. check the angle on Bulldog after I installed the 100mm longer shackles compared to Redbull where I added a piece into the adjusting screw.

Bennie,

There is a marked difference. I will need a new one, with much haste

Would you be able to organise one through Kenny?

-F_D

Fdp · Post by **Fdp** » Sat Feb 02, 2008 3:59 pm

I have an imported diff and was just wondering, has anybody here installed a difflock recently. What price are we looking at and was it worth it. I like to take my Hilux off road when ever i get a chance. (Not for the next year or so) but has to decide on new suspension vs difflock.

Post by **Family_Dog** » Sat Feb 02, 2008 5:34 pm

I'm also keen to fit a rear diff lock to Bulldog, also imported diff.

-F_D

Cookie Monster · Post by **Cookie Monster** » Sat Feb 02, 2008 7:17 pm

Hi Bennie

Would it be possible to make a few more sets of the longer rear shackles

I would be intrested in buying a set

Bogoms · Post by **Bogoms** » Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:00 pm

Question?

I have a local rear diff (Gearmax). I dont know how to describe my front diff. When i lock the front hubs and engage 4x4, the vehicle drives fine when in a straight line but when i turn there is screeching noise coming from the front wheels almost like a diff-loc that is engaged.This happens when i drive on a Hard surface.

Is this normal . As i understand there is no centre differential . Could this then be that my front spider gear assembly has seized up .

What i should actually do is jack up the front and engage the hubs. then hold 1 wheel and turn the other . If it turns then i know my spider assembly is working good.

Have any of you experienced this yet .

This might be stupid question , but forgive a 4x4 novice.

BenHur · Post by **BenHur** » Sun Feb 03, 2008 8:17 am

Cookie Monster Bull wrote:Hi Bennie

Would it be possible to make a few more sets of the longer rear shackles I would be intrested in buying a set

Yes as soon as I have the final ones fitted and I am happy with the design we can make a plan.

BenHur · Post by **BenHur** » Sun Feb 03, 2008 8:27 am

Ryan

You are not supposed to drive on sealed surfaces with 4wd engaged for exactly this reason. Because the from and rear diffs are connected directly via the transfer case with no centre differential there is a difference in rotational speed when you turn the vehicle. So you do get wind up in the transfer case. In loose surfaces the wheels will spin to "unwind" the transfer case but if the traction on the wheels is too much you will feel the vehicle's reluctance to turn and hear the tyres screaming as they try to "unwind" In the long run you will damage the transfer case if you do this too often due to the forces at play here.

For that reason permanent 4x4s have a centre diff.

Cookie Monster · Post by **Cookie Monster** » Sun Feb 03, 2008 8:35 am

Hi Bogoms

What it sounds like there is transmition wind up as there is no center diff to take up the diffrence in prop speed which will change alot when turning due to the wheel speeds which are diffrent when turning. And there is not so much diffrence when driving in a straight line. If the front diff was not allowing diffrent wheel speeds it would screech with the hubs locked and when 2 wheel drive is selected. Hope this makes sence.

Jurgen · Post by **Jurgen** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 12:36 pm

Hi All,

If anyone wants to swop a local diff for an imported one please let me know. Im in PE. 083 395 6240

Cheers
Jurgen

Post by **CasKru** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 7:32 am

I spoke to a Detroit locker distributor who recons it is not a good idea to install their autolocker on a vehicle being used for occasional off-road use.

they do have a selectable locker but not for a hilux

m2cw

Post by **Family_Dog** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 5:37 pm

CasKru wrote:I spoke to a Detroit locker distributor who recons it is not a good idea to install their autolocker on a vehicle being used for occasional off-road use. they do have a selectable locker but not for a hilux

m2cw

Cas, this is interesting, because that would be the case as far as Bulldog is concerned. So, it seems the consensus is that one should just stop moping and start collecting enough empty bottles until there is sufficient cash in the piggy bank and settle for an ARB?

-F_D

Post by **CasKru** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 7:45 pm

Cas, this is interesting, because that would be the case as far as Bulldog is concerned. So, it seems the consensus is that one should just stop moping and start collecting enough empty bottles until there is sufficient cash in the piggy bank and settle for an ARB?

Was thinking along that exact same line.... :? :? :?

I'll have to nurse the Gearmax till all my bottels are full

Cookie Monster · Post by **Cookie Monster** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 8:16 pm

I think when I eventually fit a locker it will be the ARB will just have to save up :?

Post by **Family_Dog** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 8:36 pm

I feel the need for a Group Hug...

I mean - a Group Buy!

-F_D

Post by **CasKru** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 8:43 pm

I wonder if we all go at the same time if we could organize a discount in te region of.... lets say..... for free (depends on how many of us pitch at the same time)

Cookie Monster · Post by **Cookie Monster** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 9:09 pm

Will have to wait till I can afford it

Ouarzazate · Post by **Ouarzazate** » Thu Feb 21, 2008 9:53 pm

Which differential ratios would one need to fit to bring a 2.8D (local rear Gearmax diff and difflock) with 31" tyres back to original differential ratio specs (as if it ran 215's).

And where do one get the ring and pinion gearsets?

Scorpion · Post by **Scorpion** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 9:06 pm

Hey, F_D! Count me in if you want to do a group hug... I mean group BUY! (I'm not that type of guy!

)

Post by **Family_Dog** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 9:45 pm

Getting a Rear Locker for Bulldog's rear end is really starting to burn in my rear end... ;)

-F_D

Post by **CasKru** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 8:06 am

The guys with the Landies like to call it a m-*-f-f-i-e-knoppie.

All I know it makes you almost unstoppable. It's not to say that if you've got it that you have it permanently swithed on. I like to try obsticles at least twice before engaging the diffloc (some obsticles you have to use it from the word go). It is a real peace of mind to know it's there and that it will get you out of trouble.

Post by **Family_Dog** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 10:27 am

Living in the Gamadallas, I have no real off-road trail experience. All we get anywhere here is the odd water-channel rut in a gravel road. Which is why I enjoy the Zeerust trips so much! To get to Zeerust is about a 2-hour trip on decent tar roads, with very limited traffic so it is a quiet drive. Now there are two places that I go to there:

* Our Zeerust Radio Repeater site, on top of Zeerust Koppie. Those of you who know the town, will have seen our Mast at the top of the hill, it has a giant lit Cross at night. Entrance to this site is restricted through the Army grounds and is not generally open to the public. The 'trail' (as such) is fairly easy in most places but comprises a lot of slasto-like shale rock which is often sloped sideways and very slippery. There is one particularly rocky section of the trail which I only attempt with rear locker on with the 2.7, although Bulldog does it also with relative ease in 1L and no diff locker. Any normal 4x4 without a suspension lift is unlikely to make this part of the trail. Total grading of the trail is probably 2-3 I.M.O., as the rest is fairly easy, but hilly.

* Doornrivier Farm trail. Andre & Marissa have five trails on their farm, graded by Drive Out magazine as from 3 - 5. Very enjoyable, and they do have everything you might want to consider trying. Overnight facilities are available, Camping or Chalet Hire. I really thing the Gautengelengers should pay this place a visit. http://www.doornrivier.co.za/

Point is, with my very limited off-road experiences, I would feel far more at ease if I had a rear diff-lock fitted to Bulldog, which should help me whenever/wherever.

-F_D

Post by **CasKru** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:20 am

Moet my nie verkeerd verstaan nie. I will never remove that diffloc from my bakkie. I might replace it if I were to fit one in the front.

Scorpion · Post by **Scorpion** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:56 am

F_D, I'm with you. I gives peace of mind and confidence for the "inexperienced" that should things go wrong, the locker will be their saving grace. That'swhy I want one...

Just playing devil's advocate here, but Simon stands by ARB and Riceburner is a Detroit Locker fan. Two experienced drivers with different views, but what do the other "old boys" think?

Post by **Family_Dog** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 2:27 pm

Scorpion,

I wanted the Detroit locker, but we have experienced difficulty in obtaining it from overseas. Apparently, Lockrite lockers are represented here in SA, but their 'toughness' is not as good as the Detroit locker and their operation is not as smooth-acting as that of the Detroit, although I believe they are actually built in the same factory. The various prices I have been getting for lockers varies a lot:

* Lockrite R3500 - R4000 for rear, excluding fitting
* Detroit R6000 - R7000 for rear, excluding fitting
* ARB R13000 - R14000 for rear, including fitting and Compressor
* Local Gearmax locker - Â±R4500 Doesn't apply to me, I have an imported diff and I do not want to change it for the local one.

I favoured the Detroit as being the best locker for an acceptable price. I spent quite some time on the Internet researching this, and always found positive feedback on the Detroit, but mixed feedback on the cheaper Lockrites. The major problem with the Detroit locker lies in obtaining one, it seems the Suppliers overseas never had stock at the time that I ordered and then probably support facilities would be limited if one ever needed their backup. The support problem does not exist with the ARB lockers, because they are well-represented throughout the country.

Another argument was put forward that one should not use a fixed locker such as the Detroit or Lockrite ones if most of your mileage is done on tarred roads. I don't know what wear and tear this might cause, but this is not really an issue with me because I would not use the SFA for overlanding purposes - I have the IFS Hilux for that.

Personally, I would still go for the Detroit locker if I could get it, they don't seem to break. But I might be forced to go the ARB route purely because of availability.

If we could get a reliable means of getting the lockers here from overseas, I would be game for a group buy. Perhaps we should start a show of hands for whoever would be interested in this?

-F_D

Scorpion · Post by **Scorpion** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 4:20 pm

F_D, at those prices I'll also go for Detroit - I can fit front AND rear for little more than the ARB rear alone!

I'll definitely be in on such a deal, but where do we have them fitted?

Post by **Family_Dog** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 8:35 pm

Have already spoken to my local Garageman, and he is comfortable with the fitting. One would also replace the carrier bearings as well, while it's open.

-F_D

Post by **CasKru** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 8:36 pm

Hey guys. There is a place in middleberg which is a Detroit locker agent. They said they had stock but the guy I spoke to was the one saying that if the vehicle is used more for on road than off-road, it's not such a great idea.

I personely would want to fit ARB or even Lockrite purely from the point of view that I can choose when it locks. Unlike the detroit which is a positive locker. But that is purely based on choice of control.

Detroit does make a selectable locker but unfortunatly only for bigger trucks like the Dyna

m2cw