Engine sitting at 172,000 Km's and with problems

[4x4BEES]

Jissie Martin, hope all is finally okay

[Haboob]

Don't blame the vehicle because of some idiots that do not know what they are doing...

[muntu]

Don't blame the vehicle because of some idiots that do not know what they are doing...

These "idiots" are supposed to be "professional car mechanics" unlike me. So where do you take your vehicle if most of them are incompetent?

Anyway, question for you guys: I noticed the car has a lot more power now, BUT, if I idle at a stop street or a robot I notice that it looses a bit of power. When I changed my oil filter last week, I had to pull the air box out due to the SAC intercooler conversion, otherwise I can't reach the filter. As I removed the box, I noticed a little wire sitting in the air duct coming from the wheel well, were it joins the air box. My guess is that this is the air intake sensor. I know the fan blows all the air to the left side of the vehicle, towards the air box duct. Could it be that a) the sensor is sticking out to far (IE it must be more pushed back towards the wheel well side) and b) that when idling the fan blows the hot air over the duct and the sensor senses an increase in air in take temperature, therefor the ECU gets fooled thinking its too hot so give less power?

A mate of mine services his stepdad's and his brother's KZTE and he says he has never seen that wire laying in the duct like in mine..... Any ideas??

[Reinart21]

Also not a mechanic here, but depending on where your IC sit's you could be getting heat soak.

I have the newer moddel D4D, with a top mount IC. It does suffer power loss when the engine is hot or on it's operating temperature and you at a stop or robot for a bit.

Can really say I have noticed this as when a scenario occurs and I have been doing 60-80 km/h and the IC is sufficiently cooled, a quick stop and pull off results in a "lekker" pull off.

But this is only of note if the IC is sitting somewhere that heat from the engine can soak it's cooling area.

Not sure about the sensor though...

m2cw

[muntu]

Thanks for the reply Reinart! That is exactly what I am experiencing. I got a copy of the Haynes Repair Manual and nowhere can I find a mention about this wire (looks like a temp sensor), so maybe some mod that SAC did with the intercooler (the IC is underneath the vehicle and has the turbo boost pipe running into the intake of the IC, approximately 1 meter in length, the output pipe is about the same length going to the intake manifold).

So here we have around 2 meters op pipe running through the engine bay, hot from the turbo to the IC, cooled by the IC (I doubt it) and the "cooled" air gets ducted back to the manifold through the engine bay (hot air in that bay), a scoop (like the D4D) would have made more sense to cool the engine down (ram air). I'm working my @ss this whole week but I'll pull into Toyota next week to find out about this wire (sensor) going towards my Air Cleaner Box.

[FERRIT]

It sometimes the glow plugs that make the vehicle hard to start.If they are worn or not working it will create white smoke on start up,and hard to start.In the pre combustion chambers where the glow plugs sit,the diesel that gets squirted on them does not attomised or vapourised,causing white smoke and hard to start because the diesel is not burnt,hence white smoke.It may be a problem,hpoe it helps.I hope the spelling is right I think you can get the right idea,

[muntu]

I took the vehicle to Toyo Service Centre in Krugersdorp. Ralph fixed the smoking issue, the injectors were installed wrong (too thick washers used) and burned the tips. The injectors are redone again. The burned injectors were over fuelling, although I got quite a bit of power out of the vehicle. Now with the new injectors installed the vehicle feels slow to accelerate and has a hard time driving over hills (from Krugersdorp back to Pretoria I had to downshift to 4th gear constantly). The engine is fine according to Ralph and there's nothing wrong with it. I give up......

[Reinart21]

Sorry to hear about your bad experience, I'd be ready to blow a gasket by now...

[JamesC]

It is lemon. Cut your losses and sell it.

You will always have a small voice whispering nasties...

Had two KZ-TE's and sold both. Did not learn my lesson the first time.

[muntu]

Just changed the oil brand on her, I used the original stealers oil, but the oil is just too thin and the engine was slowly burning oil (500ml/1000km roughly). After reading around and taken Ralph from Toyoservice his advice I just changed the oil and went onto Delo400. Night and day difference. The car has more power and hasn't used a drop of oil yet.. So all in all, so far so good.

[Mars]

Great to hear that. I always use Delo400. Fantastic oil!

[muntu]

Final update (vehicle fixed after spending R60,000 on it unnecessarily)...Let this be lesson to others......

I went with a fine comb today through the vehicle and found several problems caused by these "automotive engineers". I took the inlet manifold off just to have a look how bad or good the condition it was in...Again, gaskets were found placed upside down, nuts missing from several components or just the whole bolt left out, manifold nuts stripped, etc. All in all the vehicle is in a very good condition (manifold shinning clean after 4000Km's since last rebuild), boost pipes had minor oil "film layers" on it caused by natural blow by. Engine hasn't consumed a drop of oil since changing to Delo 400.....Anyway I fixed all they're f-ups. Here's a list of do's and don'ts;

First off, get a copy of the Hanyes manual, even if your not that much of a mechanic, it will help you a lot!!!!!

* If you're considering an engine rebuild make sure to go for a recommended company with a good reputation (mine was so good it took 2 overhauls because of him)

* When doing an engine rebuild, make sure injectors and injector pump are refurbished and the injector pump is recalibrated, (that alone set me back close to R8000) the engine overhaul guy quoted me on overhaul only excluding injectors and pump calibration.

* After engine rebuild drive it under a load but with a good oil (Toyota's recommended oil is no good for the vehicle and stay away from Castrol GTX which caused me glazing, I recommend Delo 400). This was another engine overhaul/re-hone

* Stay away from SAC Boksburg; they over fuelled the chip (by 17 units) causing the engine to glaze up (a further 2 times) and dyno tuned the car (without me asking for it with the engine sitting just below 2000Km's). They "recommended" a Turbo change at R11,0000 for no reason (I'm still driving around on my old refurbished Turbo).

* After engine rebuild and run in period (I recommend 1000km's) do an oil change and go for a blow by test just to make sure.
* Stay away from the Unichip unless it's installed and calibrated by a reputable company which gives you a warrantee incase they destroy the engine during dyno tuning (I've taken mine out and decided to leave it out since the last engine overhaul).

Places I recommend in the Gauteng area:

B&E auto (Benoni)
Bosh (Centurion)
Toyoservice (Krugersdorp)

Stay away from:

SAC (Boksburg)
Vaal Bank Motors (Bredell)

I thank all you guys for all the support and good advice, this forum has taught me a lot, up to the point I rather do the work myself instead of sourcing it out to an "automotive engineer".

Cheers,

Martin

[Mr_B]

Hi Martin,

All very good points! I'm not sure if it's applicable to diesel engines, but I've always used a monograde oil, like 40W, to run an engine in on. Then, personally I'd never run-in an overhauled engine with a performance chip plugged in. Once the fuelling system is overhauled and recalibrated, the chip will more than likely cause overfueling or underfueling, both of which are very detrimental during the running in process. Tuning the chip on a dyno during the run-in peroid is obviously a no-no. In fact I would leave the chip off for the first 5000km!

Hopefully you've now got a super reliable engine! I would also consider installing an EGT gauge on your new engine!

Mr B

[george]

Hi Marin

Yoh I so hope you get some good service out of the engine now.
Just a question

(I'm still driving around on my old refurbished Turbo)

Where did you get it done and at what cost.
My turbo is also leaking and I am not in the mood to spend 8k on a new turbo

[muntu]

Where did you get it done and at what cost.
My turbo is also leaking and I am not in the mood to spend 8k on a new turbo

I'll call the guys that had outsourced the turbo repair and find who he used and let you know. I spend around R5000 on the turbo repair plus installation, I believe the overhaul itself was around R4000. If I was you, call Turbo exchange and see if they've got one for a reasonable price (mine was brand new R8000 and still sitting in my garage as a back up).

When you say your turbo is leaking, where is the leak coming from? IE, are you sure it's the turbo and not caused by excessive blow by, or the oil return pipe maybe cracked (common thing on the KZTE, replacing mine next week).

[george]

Hi Martin. i am not sure. I just have some oil in the intake throttle. My turbo sits on 380k so I presume it is a combination of by pass oil and seals going on the turbo.

[muntu]

Your best deal would probably be http://www.turbodirect.co.za" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; They sell aftermarket turbo's (from Brazil) for around R3000. Run the engine on idle and take off the breather pipe to see if it's not blowing out excessive oil (blow by) before spending money on a new turbo. When you say that you found oil in the intake manifold, I take it you don't have an intercooler installed? What's worth doing (did mine last week) is remove the inlet manifold (replace gaskets, around R100 for all 4) and clean out the entire manifold and the turbo boost pipes. Use part cleaner and a tooth brush to get all the old sooth out the manifold. For the boost pipes use Clean Green and oven cleaner. Once cleaned and reinstalled, drive around for about 1000Km's and check again, it might just be oil that accumulated over the years.....

[Firstoneman]

I'm new to the forum. Somewhat recently planted in Maputo, from US, just bought my first car on another continent - 1999 Surf (not a diesel - but the thread interests me because I've been advised to buy one eventually), and needing advice on how to get diagnostic info out of this thing. But that's a post for elsewhere in the forum.

I can't help but respond after reading about your trials Martin. This scenario reminded of lessons learned long ago, in equal measure, from both automotive and medical professionals. Because of those experiences, I spent time reflecting upon my dwindling financial resources, poor health and automotive woes and came up with a pithy saying that has served me well now for 30+ years…"Anyone whose financial well-being relies upon my lack of well-being (i.e. my misfortune, a breakdown, etc...) is suspect." I determined then that I had to be up enough on whatever it was to be able to hold them accountable to some standard that would satisfy my condition. So far, so good. Every time I have ended with a problem in such an area since then I have been forced to conclude that I came up short on my due diligence. I needn't be as knowledgeable as a professional, but I sure need to know as much as I can know in whatever time frame I have to deal with, that puts em on alert that I'm at the very least not an ignorant fella. I let God take care of the rest…even my failures.

All that said, Martin (if you're still around), how is your Toyo running since May?

Cheers!
David

[dalkill]

Eish Martin...

i feel your pain... I too think i may have bought a lemon.... and i ventured outside my toyota stable for the first time with bakkies...
But i don't think it the Isuzu brand to blame. I think previous owner(s) simply did not take care of vehicle.
Since 25th May when i got the vehicle i spent about R10K on glow plugs, battery, clutch, some slave cylinder on gearbox, front brakes and disk which had nothing on.. and machie suspects maybe there is issue with diesel pump that is why previous owners simply put on facet pump to aid... i thought that was part of the LR tank setup..

I hope you come right with the bakkie, or at least sell it for good price to recover some of your costs

[Drifter X]

Martin I feel your pain.....if you intend on keeping the lux I would strongly urge you to fit in an EGT unit. This will definitely help in the long run. Fitted mine myself, I purchased the Madman unit. Best of luck.

[muntu]

Hi guys,

The vehicle is doing fine, it's got a little over 9000KM's since the last overhaul. It has more power as well now. Took her out over the weekend to Potch and back and cruised around in Potch for about 70KM's as well, all this with the aircon on. Fuel consumption for the trip resulted on average 11KM's/Litre, doing 100KPH on the highway and 60KPH in town.

The only thing what worries me is that there's like a ticking sound when you rev over 2500 rpm and when you push during acceleration is sounds if the manifold is just sucking up a lot of air. After I push it a bit (fast acceleration and high RPM (3000) the sound goes away and she doesn't smoke this black smoke anymore for a while but this in turn has caused the sucking noise in the intake manifold.

It's using half a pint of oil (Delo400) on about 1500KM's so that's not bad. Next 10,000KM service is up in 3000KM's. I'll take the intake manifold off again and clean it along with the intercooler just to see if that does anything.

Other than that she seems as strong as an ox.

[dalkill]

that good to hear martin...

but correct me if i'm wrong... recommended diesel service not every 7500km?

[muntu]

that good to hear martin...

but correct me if i'm wrong... recommended diesel service not every 7500km?

So I hear from the other guys here. I do oil+filter change every 5000km's and every 10,000km's full service.

[JohanW]

Muntu, check that turbo. It doesn't seem to be boosting correctly. So your intake manifold pressure is low up to below 3000 which leads to incomplete combustion also known as overfuelling. As you go above 3000 the little boost your turbo creates is just enough to stop the overfuelling and combust better. You can take off the hot side of the turbo and check for oil. A thin film is fine, runny oil everywhere is not. To recon the turbo with new seals is about R1800 excl labour. Did my turbo a few months back.

The kz-te has a obd2 port just above your left foot under the dash. You can read the intake manifold pressure from it. it should be about 160-180 kpa from 2500-3000rpm.

I change oil every 5000km, oil filter every 10000km, air and diesel filters every 20000km. use about 300ml oil in 5000km. got new rings 25k km back. currently sitting on 305k km and running like a bat out of hell.

[muntu]

Thanks Johan, I've got an OBD2 reader, I'll check what pressures I'm getting. She is definitely getting faster and more powerful. Just done 10,000KM's since last overhaul so my guess is the rings are finally settling a bit. The boost pipe (to the intercooler and to the inlet manifold) are both clean. A tiny film of oil.

I've got a brand new spare turbo sitting in my garage, should the turbo prove to be a problem, I'll change it, but there is no lack of boost while driving it.

[muntu]

Lo Johan,
SAC did tell me before that my current turbo is under performing, the results below. I bought a new original turbo from SAC and that one put's out a max of 1.6....That turbo I kept as a spare. Could it be that there's a loss in pressure due to the SAC intercooler conversion?


Idle



2000 RPM



2500



3000 RPM

[JohanW]

Muntu, from those pics I can see that your turbo is doing sweet boggerol. Its not creating any boost.

BUT it will also look like that if you did the test at standstill. Go find a hill and redo the test.

[muntu]

It was done static... Can't drive and take screenshots. I'll see if I can do the test again while actually driving.

[Hoppy]

http://www.aagaskets.com.au/Mobile/showGHG.aspx?ID=29

[Plodding2]

Thanks Eric! The oil and filter is getting replaced in 80Km's, that's when the engine sits on 1000Km's since overhaul. Any idea why she's hard to start and giving that blue smoke on start up?

More often than not oil running down the valve guide's