Slight shuddering when pulling away

[ptolemytoo]

Hello all

My 1998 4X4 3.0 ltr non-turbo diesel twin cab Hilux, with 250,000 on the clock, was involved in an accident. I was traveling back to Cape Town on the N1, towing my motorcycle on a trailer. 50 odd km from Beaufort West, someone tried to overtake me into oncoming traffic. When it became obvious that she was not going to make it, she swung back in and hit my trailer. (I won't even talk about the bike.)

The impact was on the right rear of the trailer, causing the entire bakkie and trailer to be rotated 180 degrees and ending up in the grass and sloot on the opposite side of of the road, facing the on coming traffic. Thankfully, there was no other traffic at the time or it could have been much worse.

My tow-bar looked like a pretzel and was more or less completely ripped out of the chassis. At first glance there did not appear to be too much damage; in fact I was able to drive from the site of the accident--20km on the Cape Town side of Three Sisters--all the back to Bellville. All repairs were done with varying degrees of hassles which I will not go into now. Chassis was checked etc.

All of the above was setting the scene for my question. I did have my prop-shafts checked and was told that although balancing was recommended, there did not appear to be any accident damage. Recently, I have noticed that when I pull away in first, there is a bit of shuddering until I start accelerating towards 2nd gear. If I increase the amount of throttle on pull off, I can avoid the shuddering.

So, firstly, any ideas what is the cause of the shuddering? Could it be the prop-shaft? Secondly, if it is the prop-shaft, could the accident have caused it? There is no other vibration or shuddering when driving normally.

To give you an idea of other damage to the under-carriage: The control unit for the rear diff lock was damaged and had to be replaced and all the wires running into it were ripped apart and had to be soldered together. Also the exhaust was broken just after the first silencer, mid vehicle.

Just as a matter of interest, after I got the bakkie back from the panel beaters, it started making a strange noise and had a weird vibration. It turns out that one of the roller bearing in the diff had come apart and a roller had fallen between the gears, taking a big chunk out. Fortunately the insurance covered it as accident damage, otherwise I would be R13000 out of pocket.

Any ideas, suggestions and advice would be appreciated.

Regards

[Dadz Toy BFI]

Check your centre bearing (just before the propshaft joint)

Lay on your back on the floor, push the propshaft upwards - there should be no movement :!:

[OOOOMS]

I had a similar shudder when pulling away, (perhaps not related to your accident) but replaced the enjine / gearbox mounts, which solved my problem. Easy to remove and check

[Mud Dog]

If this is not a clutch shudder (only experienced when using the clutch at pull-off) then I would check all engine and gearbox mounts, the propshaft carrier bearing and the bearing cradle itself. Also look for play at the bearing where the prop-shaft enters the diff.

[ptolemytoo]

Guys, thanks very much for your responses.

I'm going to check everything you mention.

Mud Dog's post got me thinking. I think it may be a clutch shudder because it only happens using the clutch on pull off. What does that mean? Does that mean my clutch is on the way out? Pardon me for being a bit dof on this subject.

Cheers

Harry

[Mud Dog]

Clutch shudder is the most common cause. I'm afraid that's what it means .... it's on it's way out. It might not even be worn .... the clutch plate and / or pressure plate / flywheel can be burnt. There could even be oil from the crank seal that's leaked onto the plate.

Either way it has to come out and be checked out to see if the flywheel needs a light skim and the clutch plate / pressure plate need to be replaced. The release bearing must be done at the same time and the spiggot bearing checked as well. Parts should be somewhere in the region of about 1½ K if you use Luk-Repco components, which I would suggest. If the crank seal has been leaking, it can be done at the same time, but insist on a genuine toyota seal .... not a pirate part.

Best of luck.

[ptolemytoo]

Thanks Mud Dog

I was afraid of that. I will have to see what my next move is. I'm not qualified or competent to do this myself, so apart from the cost of the parts I will have to factor in the cost of it being done by a competent person.

Any suggestions as to a competent and reliable person or organisation in Cape Town would be welcome.

Regards

Harry

[Dadz Toy BFI]

Thanks Mud Dog

I was afraid of that. I will have to see what my next move is. I'm not qualified or competent to do this myself, so apart from the cost of the parts I will have to factor in the cost of it being done by a competent person.

Any suggestions as to a competent and reliable person or organisation in Cape Town would be welcome.

Regards

Harry

I can highly recommend Fellow Hilux Nut Jacques Fouche

Jacques Workshop
12 Huguenot
Parow
jacuesworkshop@telkomsa.net

Dadz is there 2mrw for a good shake down or I should say shake-UP

[Stuart Baak]

Hmm, to bring up this old post, I get a slight shudder on my AUTO as described above? Any ideas? Clutch can't be going? It's an auto with only 105kkm on the clock...

[Stef]

Could be your universal joints, mine went at the rear diff's side. Vibration was at a certain speed though, not from pull away.

[Stuart Baak]

Mine is at about 7kmph, at approx 1000rpm,but if I give it power, no shudder? Hmmmm

[Stuart Baak]

Oh, and mainly on uphill

[Stef]

Sounds like the universals yes, mine (the bakkie's in other words ) did it at 30km/h, mostly went away when accelerating, just depends on the wear i.e 1 bearing, 2 bearings shot, all 4 worn etc.

I would start there, then centre bearing ( if it has one) then the rest of the drive train as mentioned above. if it's not one of those, check mountings on engine & tranny.

[Stuart Baak]

Ai I think I just got a migrane...i am about as mechanically savvy as a drunk worshonkie with a plastic screwdriver in its mouth...

[Stef]

Just stop by at a propshaft place and have them look it over, but pretty easy...check for play on the small bearings where the the 2 "forks" are joined by that cross bar like thingy in the middle

[Stuart Baak]

Ah okay so prop shaft is not allowed to have playtime and if they do, that's my problem?

[Stuart Baak]

If it has play I'll take it to the Stealers cos I have mechanical warranty. Let's hope they cover it

[Stef]

Ah okay so prop shaft is not allowed to have playtime and if they do, that's my problem?

Not at the universal joint, no. You will be able to rotate the propshaft back & forth somewhat but the flange at the diff side of the joint should move with. Play between the 2 sides of the universal joint means the brearings are worn and could cause the vibration.

Hope that makes sense..

[Stuart Baak]

I'll get under the car on Friday and have a squiz

[Stuart Baak]

Okay van is at the Stealers for the 110k km service and they will look into the shudder. Forced the guy to test drive with me so they know what it is. After many pull off's he is aware of the shudder, and will look into it.

Will report when I have feedback. I hope I don't need to get the Vaseline out for this endeavour.

[Stuart Baak]

Sooo they say since I have lifted the Vigo 40mm,the prop is at a bigger angle and hence it's the lift causing the problem.... Anyone else experience this? They say their lifts of 30mm doesn't cause this... R4.5k to recondition the prop and replace centre bearing.

Are their views valid or b/s

[Family_Dog]

Stuart, I would say they have a very valid point there. I was warned about this sort of thing by our local Propshaft Centre guy, and I would believe him without any hesitation.


-F_D

[Stef]

Makes sense...but 40mm lift should not cause that big a change in angle should it? Unless the props are really short or it is just very sensitive to slight changes....

Price not too bad I suppose, considering the centre bearing alone is around R2k if memory serves