Driving Safety Standards.

Read this before embarking on a Trip or Trail
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ThysdJ
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Tue Jan 29, 2008 9:24 am

During Saturday's Tierkloof Trail I made the following observations and I would like to share it with you.

1. Following Distances
All participants must at all times maintain a safe following distance. It does get a little claustrophobic when the vehicle behind is driving on your rear bumper. There is no prescribed distance but it needs to be varied according to the terrain. Always allow the driver in front of you enough space to maneuver and/or get into position to attempt an obstacle and to back up, should he not make it. This should not be limited to serious obstacles but also any uphill where there is a chance that the vehicle in front can stall or has to back up for whatever reason. This is not freeway driving and 2 seconds is not enough. :p

2. Clutch!
Some drivers simply pushes in the clutch and free wheel down steep inclines, sometimes even in reverse!!. This is extremely dangerous, especially on loose surfaces, as once the vehicle is out of control (free wheeling too fast) it is near to impossible to regain control and it can have serious or even fatal consequences. A free wheeling vehicle on a steep decline can double its speed every 5 meters. Go do the math! ALWAYS keep the vehicle in gear and go down hill against compression. That way you always have some measure of control over the vehicle as the engine is braking the vehicle. Keep your foot on the brake to regulate the speed and if needs be even stall the vehicle to get it to stop on very a steep descend. When starting up the vehicle NEVER push in the clutch but let the vehicle run with the starter motor until the engine fires. I always put my left leg under the seat when I go down hill to prevent me from accidently using the clutch. (Thats why I have that funny expression on my face when I drive) :D

3. Parking.
When there is an obstacle in the trail and everybody wants to stop and watch the rest of the group coming through, the lead vehicle on the trail must always drive down the trail far enough to allow all the vehicles behind to have parking and leave enough space for the last vehicle to negotiate the obstacle safely and to park on a flat area, not hanging on some ledge by the skin of his teeth.

4. Spectators/Photographers
Spectators must always watch from a safe distance. Photographers must use the zoom facility on their cameras to get up close. It is pretty exciting to lean in under the front wheel and take pictures of oil leaks under a vehicle hanging in the air, but the driver has no idea where the photographer is and it could potentialy have some serious consequences. It does happen that a vehicle negotiating an obstacle does not always go exactly where the driver intends for it to go. Now couple that with a photographer/spectator inspecting the suspension upgrades on the vehicle and you can see where I am going with this....... :?

5. Spotting.
Please assist fellow drivers in tight spots by spotting and guiding them through so they do not damage their vehicles. Also spot when drivers are backing up to get in position for an obstacle. This will prevent the driver from driving into unseen holes/cliffs/rocks/tortoises or other road hazards.

6. Environment
If there are any special rules it would be great if the trail owner can explain them to all drivers. All drivers MUST stick to the rules of the trail, we want to be able to come back and do the trail again at a later stage. I am proud to say that on this trip everybody stayed on the track and nobody damaged any fauna and flora. Give yourselves a great big pat on the back for that. That will show old Kortbroek we are not a bunch of hooligans hell-bent on destroying nature and the environment just for our own pleasure.

7. Pre-Trail Vehicle Inspection
This should be done in any case, but it is worth noting here. Also be sure all the goodies in the back is strapped down securely, as a flying Engel or hi-lift jack can be pretty lethal.

8. Have Patience/Calm Down
When attempting an obstacle and things are not working out exactly the way you plan, stay calm. Once you get worked up, you transfer that stress to your vehicle. It is amazing how quickly that stress changes to aggression and that is when you drive your vehicle in a way that is not safe for yourself, your vehicle or the spectators. If after 2 or maximum 3 attempts you still dont make an obstacle, sit back and let the next guy go. Catch a breather, have a SZ, and see what lines the next guy takes. This teaches you to "read" the obstacle and to take the route of least resistance.

9. Vehicle Recovery
There are many recovery rules to observe and I am not going to go into all of them here, but at least one person on the trail should know them and that person should take charge of all recoveries. Also people should use common sense and spectators not directly involved in the recovery effort should stand well clear.

a.All spectators must stand back at least 1.5 times the length of a kinetic strap/rope or winch cable.
b.Always use rated recovery points on a vehicle. NOT towballs/bullbars/rear view mirrors/skaaptralies.
c.Never straddle a tow rope/snatch strap that is attached to 2 vehicles.
Too many more to list here.

Recovery equipment. Every vehicle should be equiped with its own recovery equipment. Especially snatch straps/ropes. These items have a limited life span and it is not fair to use somebody else's equipment. Therefore, should a driver not have his own equipment, and another he uses somebody else's equipment the donor should be re-imbursed for the use of his equipment.

10 Drinking on the Trail
Personally I think drinking alcohol should be banned while driving a trail, but that is my personal preference. It has been proven too many times that drinking and sound judgement cannot exist at the same time. Drink soft drinks and water while driving, and once the trail is over, the braai-fires are burning and the cars are parked, break out the hard tack/beers/tafels/mampoer/brannas or whatever. Remember that impaired judgement due to alcohol intake does not only affect the driver, it definitely also affects the passengers, and could potentially affect fellow drivers, with serious consequences. Discression should be used if any driver simply cannot resist the temptation to have a beer, but the trail leader should have the right to intervene when any driver becomes a danger to himself and/or others.

11 Driving Skills/Pressure.
Don’t feel pressured into doing anything you do not feel comfortable doing. Sure people will give you lots of lip about it, but if you feel you are not going to make an obstacle for what ever reason, it is YOUR decision as driver in charge of the vehicle whether you are going to try it or not. Remember you have your own life and the lives your passengers and even spectators in your hands. Personally I would rather take the “lip” afterwards at the braai fire while I can still breathe that not hear what they say about me in my obituary. Rather be safe than sorry……

12 Playtime/Crowd control
When participants are playing at an obstacle, the driver MUST at all times ensure that all the spectators are aware of his intended actions. If this is not possible, he should let the Group Leader/Safety Officer know of his intentions to enable him to do proper crowd control. The Group Leader/Safety Officer cannot be held responsible if he was not informed. No obstacle in such a case shall be attempted unless the Group Leader/Safety Officer gave the all clear to the driver, either by means of radio communication or agreed hand signal. Children must always be under adult supervision, and at a safe distance.

13 Vehicle tampering / practical jokes
It is very funny to unlock a vehicle's front hub without the driver knowing about it and to see him struggle to get up a hill. It is even more dangerous than funny. This practice will not be tollerated on Hilux4x4 outings. This could lead to vehicle damage, and even to injury or death,if the vehicle loses traction and goes over a cliff. Want to know more? Read here: viewtopic.php?f=63&t=22516" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

14 Passengers/Seatbelts
No passengers on the back of any bakkie while negotiating an obstacle, whether the bakkie has a canopy or not. One seatbelt, one passenger. Drivers and passengers are to wear seat belts at all times, except when doing water crossings. Driving thru a puddle is not a water crossing.


I think we should make these points part of a standard pre-trail drivers briefing so that all drivers are reminded and that newbies are informed. Does anybody else have any points that we can add to this :?: :?: :?:
Last edited by ThysdJ on Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:55 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Tue Jan 29, 2008 1:45 pm

Kaspaas baie goeie topic 8) Ek het so paar jaar gelede geleer dat jou ego nie saam met jou moet 4x4 nie. Ons was op 'n 4x4 opleidings naweek in die Korranna berge van Zoelenhoek was die plaas se naam. Baie nice plek maar daar het ek groot geword met 4x4 ry. Die obstical was 'n baie klein oorkruis wallietjie maar min wetende het een aap my bakkie se voor hubs uitgedraai :twisted: en ek pak die roete aan op 4x2. :shock: By die klein wal sonder diff lock staan die bakkie en kan net nie daar oor kom nie. Alle oë is op jou gerig, jy word ge-evalueer en daar staan ek :oops: Dit voel naderhand jy ry die bakkie breek en toe merk hulle dat my hubs nie gelock was nie. Geen probleem toe die hande viervoet vat nie maar daar het ek net eenvoudig besluit jou ego moet by die huis bly. Daar en dan geleer dat as jy nie kan 'n obstical oorkom nie sit terug en kyk hoe doen die ander dit. :wink:
So by the way wat is 'n SZ. :?:
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ThysdJ
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Tue Jan 29, 2008 1:49 pm

SZ = Sprite Zero... :D
Koring-koeldranke en polisie-koffie werk nie op 'n trail nie... :shock: :cry: :cry:

Brannewyn het nie brieke nie en al daai dinge.. drink jou dop na die tyd as al die karre ge-park is en die braai-vure brand.... 8) 8) 8)
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Tue Jan 29, 2008 2:18 pm

I feel very strongly about drinking while driving. But that is just my personal preference. :shock:

The problem with 1 beer is that it becomes 2 and maybe 3... and I know there are guys out there that can drink 12 beers and be fine, but there are also those that drinks 1 beer and fall over.. So where do you draw the line. :?: :?:

I think that it should at least be mentioned, and that everybody should use his/her own discression, but if things get out of hand somebody should intervene :?:

Ek klink soos 'n dominee/pastoor/priester/rabbi!!!! :shock: :shock: :D Iemand gee asb 'n dop aan!! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
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Tue Jan 29, 2008 2:21 pm

8) , maar as dit ander in die groep laat ongemaklik voel moet mens dit seker respekteer - of seker maak dat hulle jou nie sien nie :twisted:
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ThysdJ
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Tue Jan 29, 2008 3:05 pm

Okay enough about the drinking thing now, I am getting thirsty. Final word on that is discression... :shock: :D :lol:
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Tue Jan 29, 2008 3:13 pm

I agree.

Maybe another point.Each person should make sure that they have there own recovery equipment.
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ThysdJ
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Tue Jan 29, 2008 3:16 pm

Agreed George... or thay can use mine, but once they used it they keep it and replace it... 8) :D
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Tue Jan 29, 2008 3:21 pm

Sorry ja ek stem met daai een - ek het nie ene gehad nie en moes recover word :oops: Het nou my eie strap en D shackles. O ja,`n universal wheelspanner. Daai L-shape spanners wat saam met bakkies kom is dodelik en as jy nie pasop nie kan jy jou kneters verniel
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Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:26 pm

Thys,

Thanks for an excellent article on a Pre-Trail Driver's Briefing!!

Guys, I think this warrants to be kept as a sticky, and a reminder for us all, but let's try stick to the theme and not fill it with small talk, which would only distract from the excellent advice that Thys and others have so kindly given.

I think we should move it from the Campfire chat to a more prominent position.


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Tue Jan 29, 2008 7:43 pm

Can't agree more.... some of this info can safe lives!
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Wed Jan 30, 2008 7:23 am

I agree lets finalise the list glean it up and copy it to a separate topic which will be kept as a sticky.

As far as Alcohol is concerned I too are stronly against any form of alcohol while driving, because if it is permitted their is always one or two okes that do not know their limits. I have driven with more then one official club that has a zero tolerance rule on that one and I agree. I have left a group on a trail in the middle of the drive because a few of them were drinking and I did not want to be there when disaster struck

Van Zyl You must replace the D shackles with bow shackles. It has been discussed many times search here and on the community forum and you will see why :wink:

Another thing that I hate is children or even grown ups on the back of bakkies or (Can you believe I actually saw that recently) on top of roof racks or standing on tow bars or side steps while the vehicle is negotiating serious obstacles where roll over is a great possibility or where the speed that the vehicle is traveling at may flung them off the vehicle. I despise it when people do not ensure the safety of their siblings and if something happens they ask "Why did this happen to me?" afterwards :evil: :evil:

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Wed Jan 30, 2008 7:30 am

Bennie... I can't agree more.

The same thing gets to me on the road as well when people allow their children to stand on the front seat and do not restrain them in a car seat tat the back. Friend of mine lost his wife and two kids in an accident. If his kids were in child seats they most probably would have survived. (hit a truck with no lights standing almost still on highway)

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Wed Jan 30, 2008 7:44 am

Thanks for the positive feedback guys :!: I added some of the points raised yesterday to the original post. :shock: :D
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Mon Feb 04, 2008 8:21 pm

My first time on.
Man dis lekkerrrr om saam te praat.
I agree completely that all rules should be discussed prior to starting a trail, the few that i have been on (2) nobody was told to watch distances especialy on obsticles etc.
Genoeg vir nou die eerste keer.
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Thu Feb 07, 2008 10:36 am

I think we need to add one thing

Convoy rules.

1. Everybody drives with there headlights on.
2. You are responsible for the car behind you.
3. When you cannot see the car behind you or you see that he is falling behind, slowdown or even stop. The car infront of you will do the same, and so the convoy will come to stop.

Kaspaas, if you want, I can sent you our list of rules we use in our club. Maybe there is something you can use.
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ThysdJ
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Thu Feb 07, 2008 12:57 pm

Castos wrote:Kaspaas, if you want, I can sent you our list of rules we use in our club. Maybe there is something you can use.
Reynard, you are welcome to list some of your club's rules, but try not to duplicate stuff that we already have. Then once we are sure we have a comprehensive list, I will work it all into one document that everybody here can use. :D :shock: :lol:
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Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:56 pm

Een garsprodukkie kan seker nie te veel skade berokken nie, maar wat ek al gesien het is dat drank en roetes meestal omgekeerd eweredig is aan mekaar. Wat ek graag wil weet is waar in die ry voertuie betuurders met min ervaring moet wees? Ons crowd hier in die Suidpunt probeer dat sover moontlik, elkeen 'n radio in sy voertuig het. Help nogal vir raad en waarskuwings. Wat het julle gevind is die beste banddruk?
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Sat Oct 18, 2008 8:29 pm

And let us see if these ideas are used at the national get together, put me in front with my hilux and i will set the pace offroad with my marlin :lol:
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Sun Oct 19, 2008 4:12 pm

SYRON CONVERSIONS wrote: i will set the pace offroad with my marlin :lol:
Simon

I think the guys want to complete the trail and be back home in time to watch the soccer world cup :wink:

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Sun Oct 19, 2008 7:35 pm

BenHur wrote:
SYRON CONVERSIONS wrote: i will set the pace offroad with my marlin :lol:
Simon

I think the guys want to complete the trail and be back home in time to watch the soccer world cup :wink:
Brilliant Bennie!!!! :D: :D: :D: :D:
I think that most guys would agree to that!!! :wink:
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Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:30 am

Thanks Thys for the info. Have printed it out to carry in my Hilux to remind me until it becomes second nature. You were right I did re-do the trail in my mind before I fell asleep. Thanks again for sharing the benefit of your wisdom and experience so that even a girl can drive the track and make it, whilst having heart palpitations, hyperventilating, shaking knees and sweaty palms. Sjoe but that Hilux of mine rocks.....
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Tue Aug 16, 2011 8:30 am

vald wrote: Have printed it out to carry in my Hilux to remind me until it becomes second nature.
Great idea Val. :thumbup: :thumbup:
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Tue Aug 16, 2011 8:53 am

This is definitely something we should all read (and re-read, and re-read.....). :thumbup:
As we arrange outings through the forum, I think we should all abide by these rules - no exception! :stop:
By taking short-cuts or ignoring the basic rules, it could result in an unpleasant trip (or worse...).
Safety first!! :thumbup:
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 1:08 pm

I added the following paragraph to the Pre-Trial Drivers Briefing:
12 Playtime/Crowd control
When participants are playing at an obstacle, the driver MUST at all times ensure that all the spectators are aware of his intended actions. If this is not possible, he should let the Group Leader/Safety Officer know of his intentions to enable him to do proper crowd control. The Group Leader/Safety Officer cannot be held responsible if he was not informed. No obstacle in such a case shall be attempted unless the Group Leader/Safety Officer gave the all clear to the driver, either by means of radio communication or agreed hand signal. Children must always be under adult supervision, and at a safe distance.
Please read and familiarise yourself with this document.
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 1:13 pm

ThysdJ wrote:I added the following paragraph to the Pre-Trial Drivers Briefing:
12 Playtime/Crowd control
When participants are playing at an obstacle, the driver MUST at all times ensure that all the spectators are aware of his intended actions. If this is not possible, he should let the Group Leader/Safety Officer know of his intentions to enable him to do proper crowd control. The Group Leader/Safety Officer cannot be held responsible if he was not informed. No obstacle in such a case shall be attempted unless the Group Leader/Safety Officer gave the all clear to the driver, either by means of radio communication or agreed hand signal. Children must always be under adult supervision, and at a safe distance.
Please read and familiarise yourself with this document.
Thanks Thys... stem 150% saam
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 1:49 pm

Thys, excellent article/rules and regs! One thing I can think of is mechanical assistance and tampering. Do not tamper with another mans vehicle, even if it's a silly joke. Those silly jokes can have serious consequences. If your vehicle breaks down, and there's an experienced mech around, let him advice on the best course of action. If not allow the appointed safety officer to evaluate the attempted repair. If it's deemed satisfactory, continue with the trail. Otherwise rather catch a ride with a club member and come back with right tools to repair. I did Babylonstoerin with friends a few years back, at the top of the trail one of the Jeep's brake lines snapped, which led to a rather hairy exit down the mountain. If the bush repairs fails suddenly you could be in for a world of hurt!

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Mon Jul 30, 2012 1:51 pm

Mr_B wrote:Thys, excellent article/rules and regs! One thing I can think of is mechanical assistance and tampering. Do not tamper with another mans vehicle, even if it's a silly joke. Those silly jokes can have serious consequences. If your vehicle breaks down, and there's an experienced mech around, let him advice on the best course of action. If not allow the appointed safety officer to evaluate the attempted repair. If it's deemed satisfactory, continue with the trail. Otherwise rather catch a ride with a club member and come back with right tools to repair. I did Babylonstoerin with friends a few years back, at the top of the trail one of the Jeep's brake lines snapped, which led to a rather hairy exit down the mountain. If the bush repairs fails suddenly you could be in for a world of hurt!
Excellent point Bretton. This includes tampering with the front wheel hubs
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 2:02 pm

Goeie ding die, wat dalk ook kan werk is as mens nie net die Trail Indemnity Form in vul nie maar ook n soorgelyke Form vir Club verwant. Op so manier kan daar beter kontrole gehou word dat almal van alle regulasies ingelig was en geteken het.
As daar dan n oortreding is is daar geen verskoning nie.
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 2:08 pm

Johannes van die See wrote:Goeie ding die, wat dalk ook kan werk is as mens nie net die Trail Indemnity Form in vul nie maar ook n soorgelyke Form vir Club verwant. Op so manier kan daar beter kontrole gehou word dat almal van alle regulasies ingelig was en geteken het.
As daar dan n oortreding is is daar geen verskoning nie.
Ek dink daai is ook 'n baie goeie idee.
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 2:42 pm

Goeie punte julle, dankie vir die insette, ek sal nou, nou m2cw byvoeg sodra my besoekers weg is :thumbup:

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Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:27 pm

Added this to the PTDB..
13 Vehicle tampering / practical jokes
It is very funny to unlock a vehicle's front hub without the driver knowing about it and to see him struggle to get up a hill. It is even more dangerous than funny. This practice will not be tollerated on Hilux4x4 outings. This could lead to vehicle damage, and even to injury or death,if the vehicle loses traction and goes over a cliff. Want to know more? Read here: viewtopic.php?f=63&t=22516" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:33 pm

ThysdJ wrote:Added this to the PTDB..
13 Vehicle tampering / practical jokes
It is very funny to unlock a vehicle's front hub without the driver knowing about it and to see him struggle to get up a hill. It is even more dangerous than funny. This practice will not be tollerated on Hilux4x4 outings. This could lead to vehicle damage, and even to injury or death,if the vehicle loses traction and goes over a cliff. Want to know more? Read here: viewtopic.php?f=63&t=22516" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks Thys
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:46 pm

Pleasure Cassie.. Now lets hope people actually read this and take it to heart.. Otherwise we are wasting our time here.. :twisted:
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 4:18 pm

ThysdJ wrote:Pleasure Cassie.. Now lets hope people actually read this and take it to heart.. Otherwise we are wasting our time here.. :twisted:
Ek dink ons moet hierdie deel maak van 'n indemniteit vorm wat ons alles voor die tyd laat teken. Voor op die form kom die details van die driver etc en agter op al die briefing details. :thumbup: :thumbup:
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 4:55 pm

Goeie idee Cassie, dan kan niemand reken hy het dit nie gelees nie want hy het daarby geteken.
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:03 pm

Some suggestions...

Convoy rule - If you can't see the guy behind you stop.

Max 3 attempts per obstacle if there is an escape route...

No alcohol on the trail - Yes I saw my 2008 post.... :confused:

How about limiting the number of vehicles per group to say 8 if possible and split equally if more as this will speed things up.

Also, lots will sign without reading...... Why not quickly go through it during the driver brief - We often have friends and newbies on trails - Just ideas :thumbup:
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:21 pm

And what about a trail debrief/prize giving right after the trail as some don't stay.... Small prizes and maybe only Hilux drivers qualify.... Hilux event after all...

Again, just ideas :)
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:39 pm

SuidWes wrote:Some suggestions...

Convoy rule - If you can't see the guy behind you stop.

Max 3 attempts per obstacle if there is an escape route...

No alcohol on the trail - Yes I saw my 2008 post.... :confused:

How about limiting the number of vehicles per group to say 8 if possible and split equally if more as this will speed things up.

Also, lots will sign without reading...... Why not quickly go through it during the driver brief - We often have friends and newbies on trails - Just ideas :thumbup:
I think some great ideas....

I firmly believe in the need for safety and that there is a need for all members driving trials be responsible and be aware of important safe driving, and spectator conduct... but if you land up throwing together a list of rules and regulations that start turning into a safety manual before each trail, people will no longer want to go on club outings and will do their own thing... Please Note... I am NOT saying that the importance of safety should be ignored, in fact it should be emphasized, but if it starts getting unnecessarily over regimented, the focus on OVER, then people will just organise their own GTG to avoid the over regulated club events. I think that the important issues should be selected and people attending the event need to sign it to verify that they have read it...

Deciding on how many people should drive a route, depends on the route and the capabilities of the people and the vehicles on the route... How do you determine that beforehand... Granted there are some criteria, but even routes change over time, and how do you know the capabilities of people and vehicles until you have driven a route with them in the first place?...


The debate and the dilemma continues...
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:53 pm

Hi Val, agree, there is the risk of lower numbers on outings but I gues it's how you do it. We had a quick session before the trail (Thanks Cassie) and it took less than 5 minutes and I beleive it is much more powerfull than something you have to read and sign - Maybe just me...

I guess one needs to weigh up the risks.....
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:07 pm

SuidWes wrote:Hi Val, agree, there is the risk of lower numbers on outings but I gues it's how you do it. We had a quick session before the trail (Thanks Cassie) and it took less than 5 minutes and I beleive it is much more powerfull than something you have to read and sign - Maybe just me...

I guess one needs to weigh up the risks.....
I fully agree with you... and before our outing we did exactly the same... in fact in the Tierkloof thread, I suggested that the people attending the event read the Pre trail briefing, and I included a link to it, so they had access to it.... And before each group left, both Thys and Allen went through safety and driving procedures...But at the end of the day we are all human and people interpret things differently..... I certainly don't believe in pumping up membership numbers at the risk of safety, but at the same time I believe we can go to the other extreme of throttling the life out of anything with over regimented rules and regulations, and then there's no point to that either.... So it's all about keeping the balance...
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:27 pm

I think we should add some fields to the indemnity form so that it takes long to complete. We also add the pre-trail details to it. We then suggest that people rather print it at home, read it, complete it, sign it and bring it with in order to save themselves time. So then they do not only sign indemnity but also that they have read and understood the trail safety points.

Splitting a group on a trail depends on a trail as Val said. But I feel splitting do not have to be a big issue. You do not have to let the groups leave hours after each other. Even if one group leaves 15 minutes after the other it also helps. I always see that half the group is ready to go and have to wait for the other half. So if there are many vehicles let the guys who are ready rather start with the trail instead of waiting for the rest. Maybe the groups catch up with each other later on but at least you still saved some time. If both groups have the same skills and pace they might not even catch up on each other even though they are only 15 minutes apart.
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:32 pm

I think that is a perfect solution.... and it means that people attending the event are being made aware of the risks and safety conditions and can then be held more accountable for their actions...
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:41 pm

Val - We're on the same page :)
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 10:48 pm

SuidWes wrote:Val - We're on the same page :)
I agree, I knew we were.... :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
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Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:52 am

Hi Thys, Pieter, Allen en Val!

Ek is maar nog nuut in hierdie game, maar ek dink nie die mense besef watter effort jul hier insit om alles 'n sukses maak nie. Daarvoor wil ek net dankie se!! Julle doen dit regtig vir die liefde van die saak sonder betaling en mense kry alles op 'n skinkbord sonder om te dink daaroor!

Ek stem heeltemal saam met die pre-trail briefing en die stel reels wat geteken moet word woor event kan begin. Ek dink ook die inspeksie voor die tyd sal ook nie 'n stegte ding wees nie. Ek stem ook saam met die volgafstande! Daar was op 'n staduim 'n persoon agter my met die af gaan by berg baie naby aan my die heeltyd agter en was so bang iets loop skeef.

Dankie weereens vir jul vriendelikheid en profesionele hulp wat jul aanbied tydens hiedie roetes.

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Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:21 am

Leo, good point... it's unnerving having someone tailing you too close, uphill or downhill... it affects your concentration on the road ahead... as you constantly having to look back to see where the bakkie behind you is... not lekker!

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Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:24 am

I had to keep a big distance from MrB going down, the stench from his bakkie was unbearable.

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Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:27 am

boerbakkie wrote:Ek dink ook die inspeksie voor die tyd sal ook nie 'n stegte ding wees nie.
Dan gaan daar maar min voertuie wees wat regtig mag saamry.. :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
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Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:36 am

tersmit wrote:I had to keep a big distance from MrB going down, the stench from his bakkie was unbearable.
Sorry Tersmit... the egg and mayo sandwiched and prunes did a job on me! :lol: :twisted:

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Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:42 am

ThysdJ wrote:
boerbakkie wrote:Ek dink ook die inspeksie voor die tyd sal ook nie 'n stegte ding wees nie.
Dan gaan daar maar min voertuie wees wat regtig mag saamry.. :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
True true... maybe a friendly request to make sure you have decent rated recovery points would be a good start... it's no fun trying to find a recovery point on a vehicle in a muddy water hole(dankie Herman :twisted: )... it's also no fun when someone vehicle is damaged because they were recovered using a "maak-a-plan" recovery point!

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Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:06 am

One graded recovery hook front and one at the back attached with the right bolts to the correct mounting point is the minimum requirement, two at each end is better. The hook itself sells for about R120 at most 4x4 outlets and it comes with bolts.
It is prefered that you have your own strap etc, but we can always help you out with that, as long as we have a propper point to attach it.
Ask Val what happens if you snatch a Hilux using so called "bullbar snatch points" fitted by Toyota.
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Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:17 am

Ek weet nou nie hoe viable dit is nie maar, se nou maar daar is genoeg fondse en die club sponsor 'n battery boor per region, kan mens nie sulke stelle aanhou en dan vir die voertuig aanbring die oggend sou hulle nie he nie. Ek meen as mens skerp bore het is dit 'n vinnige job. Die recovery hook is natuurlik vir die member se rekening
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Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:33 am

CasKru wrote:Ek weet nou nie hoe viable dit is nie maar, se nou maar daar is genoeg fondse en die club sponsor 'n battery boor per region, kan mens nie sulke stelle aanhou en dan vir die voertuig aanbring die oggend sou hulle nie he nie. Ek meen as mens skerp bore het is dit 'n vinnige job. Die recovery hook is natuurlik vir die member se rekening
To much PT Cassie, each member must have it done for themselves. What happens if that fitted recover point fails on the day, could get very messy.

Another issue is that we often have other makes of vehicles in attendance. They should rather have the recovery points fitted by a specialist that can guarantee the work.

The Vigo Hilux has 2 decent recovery points in front, I'll just have to check the rear...

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Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:36 am

CasKru wrote:Ek weet nou nie hoe viable dit is nie maar, se nou maar daar is genoeg fondse en die club sponsor 'n battery boor per region, kan mens nie sulke stelle aanhou en dan vir die voertuig aanbring die oggend sou hulle nie he nie. Ek meen as mens skerp bore het is dit 'n vinnige job. Die recovery hook is natuurlik vir die member se rekening
Ek wil nie die ou wees wat daai hake aansit nie... :twisted: :twisted:
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Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:56 am

A decent battery powered drill is an expensive item, does it warrant that kind of expense? ..... then who gets to maintain it as those batteries need to be kept charged otherwise they loose their ability to retain the charge. Also as mentioned, who takes the responsibility if one of us fit recovery hooks and something goes wrong? :(
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Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:56 am

You need a special low speed high torque drill to go through the chassis and you need a reinforcing plate for the back, rather have it fitted on your next service or contact a fiment centre.
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Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:58 am

Was just a thought... so... no... not a viable or good idea :thumbup:
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Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:01 am

Jaco wrote "Convoy rule - If you can't see the guy behind you stop."

This is certainly the most logic of all convoy rules, but funny enough, the most difficult rule to keep.
On more than 100 trips I undertook, the people still couldn't master this rule.

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Mr_B
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Tue Jul 31, 2012 1:07 pm

STAMPIE wrote:Jaco wrote "Convoy rule - If you can't see the guy behind you stop."

This is certainly the most logic of all convoy rules, but funny enough, the most difficult rule to keep.
On more than 100 trips I undertook, the people still couldn't master this rule.
There's an exception to almost every rule, on Tierkloof it is not always possible to see the vehicle behind you at all times. Just by tranversing some obstacles we lost visual contact. In those circumstances radio contact becomes very important, and the guys did very well in that respect!

I need to invest in a VHF radio soon! Thanks Roy for the loan of the handheld!
Last edited by Mr_B on Tue Jul 31, 2012 4:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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