Hilux almost caught fire

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Wed Aug 19, 2015 1:45 pm

This is my Hilux.
Started burning around the Aircon valve/pipes?

Post by **CasKru** » Wed Aug 19, 2015 1:56 pm

Any idea what caused ignition?

Obelix and Dogmatix · Post by **Obelix and Dogmatix** » Wed Aug 19, 2015 2:10 pm

Any idea what the ignition source was?
and i take it that the white sheen is the fire extinguisher powder?

Just glad you are not having to do a rebuild

Post by **Haboob** » Wed Aug 19, 2015 4:12 pm

Any idea what the ignition source was?
and i take it that the white sheen is the fire extinguisher powder?

Pierre, we are all keen to hear the full story. It may save some of us a lot of heartache & grief...

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Thu Aug 20, 2015 11:05 am

Anybody experienced this before??

Toyota cant give me answers, they still trying their best.

It started burning all around the Aircon pipes. They did a aircon test and there is no leaks.

Rebel 4x4 · Post by **Rebel 4x4** » Thu Aug 20, 2015 11:10 am

Jy moes hom laat verder brand....en 'n ander een kry

Mars · Post by **Mars** » Thu Aug 20, 2015 12:48 pm

Is yours a petrol or diesel? How did you realise it was on fire? Close one.

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Thu Aug 20, 2015 7:11 pm

Diesel, 2014 model.

When I stopped, smoke came from underneath the bonnet. Had to use a fire extinguisher

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Thu Aug 20, 2015 9:49 pm

Can someone merge this thread with the other one, dont knwo why it was posted twice.

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Thu Aug 20, 2015 10:06 pm

I dont know how this happened.

I was on my way to a customer. To be honest, I was doing around 180kph for about 10km. When I took the turn off and parked at the top to turn left, I started smelling what was to me a plastic burn smell. Being in an Industrial area, I thought it was smell from a factory. So I drove on keeping to the 60kph speedlimit for another 5km.

Stop at customer and walked into Building. When I came out after about 30min, I still did not see anything wrong, but when I opened the door the smell smacked me in the face. First thing I popped the bonnet. Then only did WHITE smoke appear. There was no flames. But smoke kept on coming out the carpet like crazy.

I thought once this go over into a real flame, the bakkie will be a gonner. So I grabbed the clients fire extinguisher and gave it two decent squirts. It kept on smoking!! Extinguisher did nothing. Then I took my wheelspanner from behind the seat, and started hitting the carpet pieces off, where the smoke was. Only when those pieces fell to the ground, the smoke stopped.

I had it towed to Toyota. They also never saw something like this. We decided it must be a aircon leak, and that the oily substance in the gas was the guilty party that ignited. The aircon was tested, no leaks whatsoever.
Toyota checked everything, for oil leaks around gearbox, or turbo, or engine, NOTHING.

We went out today to test it again, this time with extinguisher inside bakkie he he he. We nailed it for as far and long as we can, nothing happened.

For now, the only thing making sense to me, is that the bakkie must've over fueled, and at the high speed EGT temps went to high and ignited that carpet? That carpet is flame proof. Reason why it did not catch fire, but it did how ever start to smoulder and smoke. Another thing, teh day before I was teh engine bay with engine cleaner, but did hose it off with my WAP. Toyota say it can be that some of the engine cleaner was left behind the carpet, and that ignited?? Actually, nobody is sure.

So any ideas or solutions will be appreciated.

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Thu Aug 20, 2015 10:09 pm

That carpet started to burn from the bottom, up to the Aircon pipes.

CAT is removed, so heat build up in exhaust it cant be.

Std heat shield above exhaust is still in place also.

Drifter X · Post by **Drifter X** » Thu Aug 20, 2015 10:14 pm

Scary stuff, glad you managed to save the vehicle from burning up.

jafman · Post by **jafman** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 4:49 am

Intriguing...

Post by **CasKru** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 6:43 am

What's on the other side of the firewall under the aircon pipes?

According to the pic it seems that this point was the hottest

Post by **Haboob** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 7:16 am

Puzzelling...

ChrisF · Post by **ChrisF** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 7:44 am

interesting .....

A fire requires three things :
- material to burn
- oxygen
- source of ignition

Since the carpet is not flammable the source of ignition had to be applied for an extended period.

oxygen .. no issue in this case. In some fires a lack of oxygen cause the material to heat up in a smoldering state, then when oxygen is added you get flash over, clearly NOT the case here.

Source of ignition ... well here we have a few "standard" possibilities
* Electrical .. dont seem to be any wires in the area.
* "Heat" ...Pierre dealt with that in his last post. QUESTION - any possibility of a hearline crack in the exhaust system (from the manifold, through the turbo, down the pipes) which could direct hot exhaust gasses onto that area ? Extreme speeds will cause the system to run at higher temperatures and who knows ..... BUT, then I would expect to see more heat damage to the air-con pipes.
* Fuel .... I have actually been in a petrol vehicle when a fuel line cracked and sprayed fuel in the engine bay ! SCARY ! We were fortunate to be in town and stopped at a robot when the smoke came out from under bonnet. BUT, we know diesel dont "burn". And if it was a fuel burn it would be spread over a wider area.
* air conditioning system - the AC gas DONT burn, not the stuff we use. Some German vehicles do use LP-gas though !! The oil use in refrigeration system dont burn either, cant as it is used in direct contact with electrical connections on other systems.

nope, VERY strange incident. Would love to hear the final verdict on this one

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 10:50 am

For now I will put my money then on cracked exhaust.

Only thing that makes sense to me now.

Will have it checked out and give feedback

Thabogrobler · Post by **Thabogrobler** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:56 am

Jou foto gewys vir 'n pel van 'n workshop.

Hy het al so iets gesien op 'n Kz. Glo na 'n lang soektog die positiewe draad van die battery het deur geskuur en op die aircon pyp geshort. Die condensor is op rubbers gemount, dus loop die krag teen die pyp op en short teen die body - dan kry jy jou eie mobile braai!

Kyk daarna, dalk is dit ook so met joune?

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 12:17 pm

I found the problem.
Will upload pictures a bit later, struggling with photobucket.

Where the down pipe from Turbo connects onto exhaust system, I have a leak!!

The heat from there also melted plugs on my gearbox

Pics later will tell the story

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 1:24 pm

Dark marks under the downpipe is burn marks.
You can also see dark heat marks on steering rod.

Heat marks on gearbox housing.

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 1:29 pm

Im giving up trying to load pics.

Post by **CasKru** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 2:05 pm

Eina pyn. Dalk 'n goeie roep om die gearbox olie ook te vervang na dat dit so warm geword het

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 2:21 pm

Die heatshield vd exhaust het ook al begin smelt.

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 2:27 pm

4x4BEES · Post by **4x4BEES** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 3:14 pm

Well at least you know where and how and what to do to fix it. Glad it didn't turn out worse.

The Legend · Post by **The Legend** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 4:29 pm

Pierre

Beteken dit nou dat jy nie 180 km p/u met die Hi-Lux mag ry nie?

ChrisF · Post by **ChrisF** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 4:35 pm

Hey, any day we spot serious danger before it costs us money is GOOD DAY !

GLAD you found the culprit. Should be a cheap fix - at the leaking exhaust ....

But checking everything around it, replacing the gearbox oil etc, but more shlep, but certainly well worth it.

You wanny why I thought of a leak in the exhaust - Toyota Corolla started using water, but nobody could find the cause, not even the dealers. So one afternoon I asked my MIL to open the bonnet, just after she came back from the shops. There is a steal pipe along the engine from the water pump, and T-ing off to the water heater in the car. Had a pin hole leak on the T section. Only under pressure would it leak, squirting the water straight onto the exhaust.

ChrisF · Post by **ChrisF** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 4:36 pm

The Legend wrote:Pierre

Beteken dit nou dat jy nie 180 km p/u met die Hi-Lux mag ry nie?

check eers die bande druk en dat die exhaust okay is, DAN mag jy maar RY .....

The Legend · Post by **The Legend** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 6:02 pm

ChrisF wrote:
The Legend wrote:Pierre

Beteken dit nou dat jy nie 180 km p/u met die Hi-Lux mag ry nie?
check eers die bande druk en dat die exhaust okay is, DAN mag jy maar RY .....

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 8:37 pm

Goeie verskoning om na maar daai 76mm sisteem te laat bou

Thabogrobler · Post by **Thabogrobler** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 8:42 pm

Ek sal bekommerd wees!

As daai alu plaat smelt se dit die gas wat by jou turbo uitkom is dan hoer as 660 grade. Jou EGT's hardloop sekerlik te nabyaan die limiet(720)?

Het hy 'n chip in?

Thabogrobler · Post by **Thabogrobler** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 8:44 pm

Kaaskrul wrote:Goeie verskoning om na maar daai 76mm sisteem te laat bou

Of bestel De Graaff se aanbout sisteem?

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Sat Aug 22, 2015 11:34 pm

Het gekyk na De Graaf sin. Te duur.

Ja hy het n chip in. Daarom het ek die manifold vermoed van dag een af.

Thabogrobler · Post by **Thabogrobler** » Sun Aug 23, 2015 12:08 am

Watter chip?

Klink of jou trok overfuel en die egt's weg hardloop. Volgende stop is 'n gekraakte head of gesmelte piston!

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Sun Aug 23, 2015 9:25 am

Chipbox.

Maar ek het hom klaar uitgehaal, hy gaan nie weer terug in bakkie nie

Chipbox is glad nie nice nie. Al wat hy doen, is jaag die diesel druk op in die Fuel Rail, en daarom kry jy wat ek nou gekry het

Sal nou maar n Uni Chip van SAC laat insit saam die exhaust

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Mon Aug 24, 2015 5:20 pm

I went back to Toyota. They say its not their problem.

So I went to Powerflow, they check and tested, say there is no leaks on exhaust.

So what now??

Can the EGT, turbo heat and manifold heat get so high that it will melt a plastic plug on gearbox??

I feel frustrated, want to fix this but dont know where to start.

ChrisF · Post by **ChrisF** » Mon Aug 24, 2015 5:49 pm

COLD engine, start and let it idle. immediately apply soapy water to the exhaust and check for bubbles ....

my guess - no bubbles, and no leaks at normal operating temperatures.

add an EGT, keep the chip in, then drive it that hard again ,,,, and see just how those temperatures go .... now to try and get it onto a ramp without allowing time for it to cool down, bet you will then spot the leak .... except now the bubble trick wont work ...

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Mon Aug 24, 2015 6:45 pm

Viper and also De Graaff have a 76mm full system from the turbo to the back.

About the same price.

Any one have experience with these two systems?

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Tue Aug 25, 2015 3:32 pm

I'm still trying to sort this out and see what happened where, but as far as I go everyone blames someone else, and those who cant blame nobody say they cant find the fault. Had two okes also who turned the cold shoulder on me.

But I will leave the arguments, and move on.

Just a friendly warning to all, beware of the Chip Units out there, that only increase Fuel rail pressure.

Over fueling is a female dog, and when it bites, it bites hard

4x4BEES · Post by **4x4BEES** » Tue Aug 25, 2015 4:51 pm

Sorry to hear that boet.

Glad it wasn't worse and that you can still drive your bakkie.

Kaaskrul · Post by **Kaaskrul** » Wed Aug 26, 2015 3:48 pm

Bakkie booked for Dyno tune

76mm De Graaff system plus Unichip.

Post by **george** » Wed Aug 26, 2015 4:21 pm

Kaaskrul wrote:Bakkie booked for Dyno tune

76mm De Graaff system plus Unichip.

Lekker man
Interessant oor die chips.

Kan mens nie daai turbo upgrade.Hy lyk darm klein.

Hoop dit gaan goed daar