SFA Lift Options
- Maniac
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SFA Lift Options
I can only assume that this has been discussed before...but here goes anyway.
My vehicle has an OME kit installed, but I would like to get it further from the ground.
As I see it, there are three options
1:) Bigger tyres - 32" / 33 "
2:) Lift suspension (more than OME's 1 - 2")
3:) Longer schackles
Problem with 1:) is that a 4Y does not have the best highway performance with 31" on, so I can only assume that, without changing the gearing, it would not get better.
Pietpetoors's neighbour (flying Hilux on homepage) has 33"s on with standard gearing, and he still plays nicely in Atlantis Dunes. Stock standard 4Y 2.2 with Brospeed exhaust, if I am not mistaken.
Problem with 2:) There is a lot one can do with enough money, but those are hard to come by (balaklava + shotgun ). Some kits like Papa Joe's puts blocks between the axle and leafs, but what would that do to the leafs with enough twisting / torque exerted on them???
Number 3:) I saw this was discussed, but would like to know what the negatives are. Does this give you more travel on your wheels too? What else needs to be modified? What lift can this give?
A friend of mine on the forum suggested a longer main (top) leaf spring to be made up with the same centre measurements, and the logic behind this does make sense, but will it give more travel too? Longer shocks will be needed, but I would be willing to get some nice coil-overs if needs be.
Vehicle stability is also a big issue, because I love the rocks (bigger is better :D :D ) so comments on this will also be appreciated.
My vehicle has an OME kit installed, but I would like to get it further from the ground.
As I see it, there are three options
1:) Bigger tyres - 32" / 33 "
2:) Lift suspension (more than OME's 1 - 2")
3:) Longer schackles
Problem with 1:) is that a 4Y does not have the best highway performance with 31" on, so I can only assume that, without changing the gearing, it would not get better.
Pietpetoors's neighbour (flying Hilux on homepage) has 33"s on with standard gearing, and he still plays nicely in Atlantis Dunes. Stock standard 4Y 2.2 with Brospeed exhaust, if I am not mistaken.
Problem with 2:) There is a lot one can do with enough money, but those are hard to come by (balaklava + shotgun ). Some kits like Papa Joe's puts blocks between the axle and leafs, but what would that do to the leafs with enough twisting / torque exerted on them???
Number 3:) I saw this was discussed, but would like to know what the negatives are. Does this give you more travel on your wheels too? What else needs to be modified? What lift can this give?
A friend of mine on the forum suggested a longer main (top) leaf spring to be made up with the same centre measurements, and the logic behind this does make sense, but will it give more travel too? Longer shocks will be needed, but I would be willing to get some nice coil-overs if needs be.
Vehicle stability is also a big issue, because I love the rocks (bigger is better :D :D ) so comments on this will also be appreciated.
93 D/C Hilux Not 4Y, 33" Bighorns, 29 MHz, OME 3" Lift
No Ditch Too Deep, No Hill Too High!!!
No Ditch Too Deep, No Hill Too High!!!
- LouisZ
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Hi Manie,
Question, why higher?
Just remember height is only reached by making your distance greater from your lowest part of your bakkie(front and back diff) to the ground, that means higher profile tyres. The rest just make your bakkie higher on the the space between your wheel arches and wheels. The issue is that you maybe just gain 2cm better inward wheel travel, depending on your bump stops fitted on the blades in the centre.
You can go higher,just for the space between your wheel arces and wheels, but just remember,point 1 and 2 can cost you more than the initial fitment, blocks I do not trust, they can brake u-bolts, it happened 2 weeks ago with a guy at Rust de Winter and you have change your Steering, replace your shocks with that is longer. Shackles that is longer can help a bit. Tyres will cost u lot aswell, exept if you buy them 2nd hand.
With my std carb I could drive anywhere that the big boys went and even to places they can't go. Power you can better if you take your bakkie for a good dyna, you will be happy with the results.
Louis
4x4 Megaworld Menlyn Pretoria
Question, why higher?
Just remember height is only reached by making your distance greater from your lowest part of your bakkie(front and back diff) to the ground, that means higher profile tyres. The rest just make your bakkie higher on the the space between your wheel arches and wheels. The issue is that you maybe just gain 2cm better inward wheel travel, depending on your bump stops fitted on the blades in the centre.
You can go higher,just for the space between your wheel arces and wheels, but just remember,point 1 and 2 can cost you more than the initial fitment, blocks I do not trust, they can brake u-bolts, it happened 2 weeks ago with a guy at Rust de Winter and you have change your Steering, replace your shocks with that is longer. Shackles that is longer can help a bit. Tyres will cost u lot aswell, exept if you buy them 2nd hand.
With my std carb I could drive anywhere that the big boys went and even to places they can't go. Power you can better if you take your bakkie for a good dyna, you will be happy with the results.
Louis
4x4 Megaworld Menlyn Pretoria
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Manie
What Louis said.
Also remember that with any gain inone place you loose at another. It is always a trade off. The trick is to find a nice balance that is suited to your requirements.
Just one word of advice. Be very careful of coil overs. 2 reasons, first being that your shock mounts were designed for shocks only and not the extra forces that the coils will introduce, and secondly the issue with blades together with coils is that the two has different tensions that work against each other and I have seen where in certain cases that caused instability in the vehicle's off road performance. Many guys with coil overs complain that their vehicles noses start jumping when they climb up steep hills.
What Louis said.
Also remember that with any gain inone place you loose at another. It is always a trade off. The trick is to find a nice balance that is suited to your requirements.
Just one word of advice. Be very careful of coil overs. 2 reasons, first being that your shock mounts were designed for shocks only and not the extra forces that the coils will introduce, and secondly the issue with blades together with coils is that the two has different tensions that work against each other and I have seen where in certain cases that caused instability in the vehicle's off road performance. Many guys with coil overs complain that their vehicles noses start jumping when they climb up steep hills.
- Maniac
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Re: SFA Lift Options
I think I will post some photos tonight of the vehicle on level ground, and then maybe you guys can comment on the lift.
Ideal would be 33", to get the diffs off the ground.
More wheeltravel to me is more important than anything else, but I am not sure I want to go as far as moving springmounts around and stuff like that.
It just feels like the vehicle is too low, cause the scraping sound of rocks against the sliders and bellyplates are not nice.
But after all, it must still be an overland vehicle as well, so the Nam and Richtersvelld trips can still be done.
Thanks for all the comments so far guys.
Louis, did you have 33" with standard gearing on your vehicle? How did it perform onroad? Offroad is not a problem, cause 1st low is ready for anything.
Ideal would be 33", to get the diffs off the ground.
More wheeltravel to me is more important than anything else, but I am not sure I want to go as far as moving springmounts around and stuff like that.
It just feels like the vehicle is too low, cause the scraping sound of rocks against the sliders and bellyplates are not nice.
But after all, it must still be an overland vehicle as well, so the Nam and Richtersvelld trips can still be done.
Thanks for all the comments so far guys.
Louis, did you have 33" with standard gearing on your vehicle? How did it perform onroad? Offroad is not a problem, cause 1st low is ready for anything.
93 D/C Hilux Not 4Y, 33" Bighorns, 29 MHz, OME 3" Lift
No Ditch Too Deep, No Hill Too High!!!
No Ditch Too Deep, No Hill Too High!!!
- LouisZ
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Hi Manie,
I kept with the 31, they give good offroading and also not to bad on the open road. Sure like to change from all terrian to Muds sometime after the all terrians are finished just for more traction, but then I must consider the tyre noise. The ratios are std.
Performance on the open road(tar) you can only reach if you go and twinkle your engine(cam's ens.) or go bigger with your engine. I decided to only convert to EFi and can't wait to feel what the bakkie do now. The main reason will be sometime in the near future I want to venture deep into Africa and do not want to be stuck lets say with a Lexus motor giving problems and I can't get spares for it in Tanzania. The 2.2 and even 2.4 motors & spares you can get in these remote areas.
The choice is yours, just think ahead.
Louis
I kept with the 31, they give good offroading and also not to bad on the open road. Sure like to change from all terrian to Muds sometime after the all terrians are finished just for more traction, but then I must consider the tyre noise. The ratios are std.
Performance on the open road(tar) you can only reach if you go and twinkle your engine(cam's ens.) or go bigger with your engine. I decided to only convert to EFi and can't wait to feel what the bakkie do now. The main reason will be sometime in the near future I want to venture deep into Africa and do not want to be stuck lets say with a Lexus motor giving problems and I can't get spares for it in Tanzania. The 2.2 and even 2.4 motors & spares you can get in these remote areas.
The choice is yours, just think ahead.
Louis
- Family_Dog
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Re: SFA Lift Options
I agree with what Louis has said. The EFI conversion makes a world of difference, and the motor is basically standard.
-F_D
-F_D
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- Maniac
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Re: SFA Lift Options
F_D, I have been keeping up with your EFI conversion posts, and I am very interested to know the final outcome.
It is something that I am considering, and I have been shopping around for the parts.
It is something that I am considering, and I have been shopping around for the parts.
93 D/C Hilux Not 4Y, 33" Bighorns, 29 MHz, OME 3" Lift
No Ditch Too Deep, No Hill Too High!!!
No Ditch Too Deep, No Hill Too High!!!
- Maniac
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Bennie, wouldnt you fancy a month long holiday in the exotic Cape Town. Seems you would have a couple of happy customers down here wanting EFI's
93 D/C Hilux Not 4Y, 33" Bighorns, 29 MHz, OME 3" Lift
No Ditch Too Deep, No Hill Too High!!!
No Ditch Too Deep, No Hill Too High!!!
- Hoppy
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Re: SFA Lift Options
33" tyres transforms the vehicle totally,
You can fit them with your std suspension, but the front axle has to be moved forward by 35mm
The gearing is ok, 5th gear is only for downhills though.
You gain much more 4x4 ability with added traction than you lose in power
If you choose to retain the 4Y, 5.3 diff ratio's works exelent
Don't go too high, you lose stability
Rather go for softer springs and longer shocks
Longer local shocks work very well, you don't have to go for expensive imported ones.
I've fitted a 4Y hilux with 35" tyres, std gearing and EFI, it kicks ass!
You can fit them with your std suspension, but the front axle has to be moved forward by 35mm
The gearing is ok, 5th gear is only for downhills though.
You gain much more 4x4 ability with added traction than you lose in power
If you choose to retain the 4Y, 5.3 diff ratio's works exelent
Don't go too high, you lose stability
Rather go for softer springs and longer shocks
Longer local shocks work very well, you don't have to go for expensive imported ones.
I've fitted a 4Y hilux with 35" tyres, std gearing and EFI, it kicks ass!
aev@iburst.co.za
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- CasKru
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Allan. When you moved the front axle, what effect did this have on your sterring mechanism and sterring column? Has your steering angle changed? What effect did it have on your front propshaft? Doesn't now need to extend out to far?33" tyres transforms the vehicle totally,
You can fit them with your std suspension, but the front axle has to be moved forward by 35mm
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Speaking of EFI I would be first on your list. Does anyone know who does this conversion in CT and what sort of price are we looking at. I have a 4y with 33'' on and need a bit more oomph.
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Hi Guys
I am newbie to the forums, but think that I could have a tiny bit of positive input on this matter. I have a '96 2.4 D/C 4X4. I am running 33's with a about a 75mm lift on the suspension. No body lift. On a trip to Moremi last month, I was very happy with the vehicle on the road and off. I managed to mantain a steady 120km/h, with a good ( around 7km/l) consumption. This is with dual tanks, roof rack, canopy, roof tent, outback drawers, 80L fridge and all the rest that could go in. The only mods to the 22R are EFI, with a flowed head, branches, and a cam.. It really did serve me well.. Going to Bilene in Mozie at the end of the month, and will let you know how it does if anyone is interested....
I am newbie to the forums, but think that I could have a tiny bit of positive input on this matter. I have a '96 2.4 D/C 4X4. I am running 33's with a about a 75mm lift on the suspension. No body lift. On a trip to Moremi last month, I was very happy with the vehicle on the road and off. I managed to mantain a steady 120km/h, with a good ( around 7km/l) consumption. This is with dual tanks, roof rack, canopy, roof tent, outback drawers, 80L fridge and all the rest that could go in. The only mods to the 22R are EFI, with a flowed head, branches, and a cam.. It really did serve me well.. Going to Bilene in Mozie at the end of the month, and will let you know how it does if anyone is interested....
It is manditory to grow old, but not to grow up!!![/i]
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Re: SFA Lift Options
PS my axle has been moved forward, and all that has changed on the steering side is a new drop arm from the sreering box...
It is manditory to grow old, but not to grow up!!![/i]
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Hi Neil,
Welcome to the forum, that's some useful information that you have provided.
Please post some pics of your Hilux and also your EFI engine in the "Member's Rides" section.
-F_D
Welcome to the forum, that's some useful information that you have provided.
Please post some pics of your Hilux and also your EFI engine in the "Member's Rides" section.
-F_D
White Fang: 1999 2.7i DC Raider 4x4
Bull Dog: 1987 4Y-EFI 2.2 DC 4x4
Pra Dog: 1998 Prado VX 3.4
Hound Dog: 2000 2.7i SC 4x4
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Will give it a bash.....
It is manditory to grow old, but not to grow up!!![/i]
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Welcome to the forum Neil. Hope you enjoy it here.
Did you manufature the drop arm yourself or where did you buy it from?
Did you manufature the drop arm yourself or where did you buy it from?
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Hi Cassie
The drop arm is a manufactured unit, not sure by who though, bought the vehicle with the lift.
Will post some pics when I figure out how..
I am a earth moving mechanic, not a computer whiz by any means..
The drop arm is a manufactured unit, not sure by who though, bought the vehicle with the lift.
Will post some pics when I figure out how..
I am a earth moving mechanic, not a computer whiz by any means..
It is manditory to grow old, but not to grow up!!![/i]
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Re: SFA Lift Options
These are just a few pics of the bakkie, I will load the pics of the Suspension, steering and the EFI soonest
Later!
It is manditory to grow old, but not to grow up!!![/i]
- Hoppy
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Re: SFA Lift Options
The propshaft can be lengthened by 60mm, or you can make a spacer between the diff and prop flange.
The bump stops needs another centre hole
A hole for the centre bolt needs to be drilled on the left hand side (there is a 35 mm moved hole on the other side)
The tramp rod and steering link needs to be cut and welded, i weld it myself and fit a gusset on the one side(measure it exactlty, it is not 35mm!)
If you've lifted the suspension or used long travel shocks, you can angle the steering arm slightly on the ends to prevent it from touching the u bolts
PS: Don't forget to lengthen the brake pipes, they get ripped off on articulation.
The bump stops needs another centre hole
A hole for the centre bolt needs to be drilled on the left hand side (there is a 35 mm moved hole on the other side)
The tramp rod and steering link needs to be cut and welded, i weld it myself and fit a gusset on the one side(measure it exactlty, it is not 35mm!)
If you've lifted the suspension or used long travel shocks, you can angle the steering arm slightly on the ends to prevent it from touching the u bolts
PS: Don't forget to lengthen the brake pipes, they get ripped off on articulation.
aev@iburst.co.za
The trouble with trouble is...it always starts as fun.
The most precious jewels you will ever wear around your neck is the arms of your children...
" I WOULD RATHER SIT ON THE TAILGATE OF MY HILUX WITH A BEER AND A CHOP, WATCHING A FIRE, THAN DINE IN THE BEST RESTAURANT IN TOWN "
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Neil
Sorry, I stuffed up your second and third pics when I tried to fix your post. Can you just replace the urls between the [ img]......[/img] codes with the urls of he larger pics as I can't seem to find them on Imageshack as I did with the first one.
If you still struggle to post images let me know.
Sorry, I stuffed up your second and third pics when I tried to fix your post. Can you just replace the urls between the [ img]......[/img] codes with the urls of he larger pics as I can't seem to find them on Imageshack as I did with the first one.
If you still struggle to post images let me know.
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Re: SFA Lift Options
Allan do you have pics of the modified steering arm?
- Hoppy
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Re: SFA Lift Options
When Kaspaas returns from his long trip i'll take some, or if i get another one in sooner i'll post it.
aev@iburst.co.za
The trouble with trouble is...it always starts as fun.
The most precious jewels you will ever wear around your neck is the arms of your children...
" I WOULD RATHER SIT ON THE TAILGATE OF MY HILUX WITH A BEER AND A CHOP, WATCHING A FIRE, THAN DINE IN THE BEST RESTAURANT IN TOWN "