Hilux extended cab Suspension

Modifications to any other vehicles or things which can benefit any of the other vehicles owners.
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Antony
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Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:25 pm

Hi forum
I'm sure this topic has been discussed endlessly so sorry for that. I'm new here and new to 4x4ing and am searching for information on a suspension upgrade with raised body and possibly a slightly bigger wheel for my Toyota 2011 D4d Extended cab. There are so many mods to choose from I'd appreciate to input from you guys that have used various suspension in the field. Pros and cons etc. Those of you that don't make any money off of the sale if you know what I mean.
What would be the rout to follow to have great long lasting suspension with a raided body for better ground clearance?
Many thanks.

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ChrisF
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Thu Jul 28, 2016 6:03 pm

Anthony welcome to the forum.

Couple of things to consider with suspension upgrades :
- do you want to "lift" the vehicle ?
- do you want to "level" the vehicle ? (get rid of that nose down look)
- do you want a "4x4" suspension ? or more correctly :
- do you want a "trail" suspension ? (long travel)
- do you want an "overlanding" suspension ?

We needed the latter.

With overlanding, ie touring with lots and lots of tar roads between stretches of dirt and sand road, and shorter sections of trails you need a real all purpose suspension. You need :
- an upgraded suspension that stands true and level with your vehicle loaded for traveling (a standard vehicle tends to drag its rear end when fully loaded)
- you still want decent articulation for those trail sections
- you need some decent shocks that wont overheat on long stretches of corrugated gravel roads.
- the tricky bit is to find a suspension that wont be "bumpy" when the vehicle is unloaded between trips, yet that can handle the weight of all your overlanding gear ....


10 years back the answer would have been simple - get Old Man Emu (OME) suspension. It was the norm for many years, and in many ways set the standard for the modern contenders.

6 years back I opted for Ironman. It was half the price of OME, yet had the same warrantee. Gave us EXCELLENT service !! Did its fair share of trails with 4x4 club outings. Even did some scary sections when I had to go in and recovery other vehicles off tough trails. And it DID carry some hectic overlanding loads.

Today Ironman is a well established brand, and even has its own outlets. I can only hope this has not skewed its prizing .....


There are some excellent other brands out there as well. With most outlets now importing its own brands ....

There is also an excellent South African product - I just cant remember the name now. Couple of threads on this forum of members that have commented on this product and the excellent after sales service.



In your search do yourself a favour and go speak to "Johan Tires" at First Allignment Centre. You WILL notice the number of 4x4's at his shop. He is a well known person in this game. In 2010 he fitted the Ironman to my Hilux. Today he is the owner of an Ironman outlet - right opposite First Allignment Centre.

Antony
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Thu Jul 28, 2016 6:15 pm

That's all great information Chris. Thanks. I want to lift and level the body and if there is a way to change the angle after that for varied weight .. possibly air on top of the upgrade. Suspension should be for all facets of 4x4 if there is. Long trips and then 4x4 on those trips.

I'll go chat with Johan. See what he can offer up.

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ChrisF
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Thu Jul 28, 2016 7:18 pm

I am sure Thys will be adding to this thread as well.

He has a different setup. As an accredited 4x4 instructor his vehicle REALLY gets used on trails. And he has obviously seen many different brands and setups. He is also a keen traveler. Hy MAG maar raad gee ! :)

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Sat Jul 30, 2016 8:49 pm

as CHRISF pointed out: There are some excellent other brands out there as well. With most outlets now importing its own brands ....
There is also an excellent South African product - I just cant remember the name now. Couple of threads on this forum of members that have commented on this product and the excellent after sales service.

I am sure he is referring to the CAMIL Suspension. All my Hard Body [3 of them] and my SANI had CAMIL Suspension. I would have NOTHING else .. even did Baboons Pass with the Camil suspension.

If Piet Weideman did a CAMIL for the Patrol or Prado, both my cars would now be riding on CAMIL suspensions
[CAMIL does advertise in all the OffRoad magazines .. speak to Piet Weideman .. en jy kan maar vir hom sê 'Oom Mac" het jou vertwys
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Sun Jul 31, 2016 12:21 am

My 2c! I wouldn't piepie on ironman crap if it was on fire! Tho I may be a little bias as I work in an ARB store![WINKING FACE] before working there tho I had ironman on my previous lux and it was rubbish! This time I went with ome and has been great. At the end of the day it all comes down to what kind of work it'll be doin most the time and what wieght you'll be carrying! The key piont to setting up rig is "constant load" if you tell the guy in the shop you have a camper on there sometimes to go away with and he tries to tell you you need heavy springs to handle it then go somewhere else cos he doesn't know his stuff! You want springs that will hold what you have ALL the time "constant weight "! Their r plenty of good brands but I always say if you do it rite the first time you wont end up buying it twice! I'd stay away from airbags as they tent to lure people into a false sense of what they can carry! The airbags end up holding all the weight then this happens!Image Link Broken Take your time, do some research and ringing around amd if need be save a little more for the good stuff! Check out ome's new stuff too, bp51s they r the s#&t! Top dollar tho![SMILING FACE WITH OPEN MOUTH AND TIGHTLY-CLOSED EYES] Cheers Luke.

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ChrisF
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Sun Jul 31, 2016 7:46 am

Anthony three commentators .. and three different brands. :twisted: :twisted: And only "slightly" biased to each brand ... :tease:


Certainly, there are better brands, but even the best brand is only as good as selecting the correct set for your vehicle AND proper fitment.


on fitment - listen to tour operators and you WILL hear that the bulk of breakdowns on trips are as a result of poor installations. This goes for all types of installations, but as this is a suspension thread, loose bolts are sadly a common occurance after suspension work.

When dealing with somebody like Johan Tires you have the system installed, vehicle measured for levelness, then you bring it back a week later for another quick check. A 1000km later it comes back for yet another checkup. All things considered, I believe the choice of installer is as important as the brand of suspension.


As for weight and selection of suspension .... Springs are rated in mm deflection per kg load. Thus any and all suspensions you will have a "high stance" under no load, and it will drop as you add load. The spring rate will determine by how much it drops.


Thus the catalogues have tables where you choose the correct springs for your "typical load".


In contrast to this some of the top suspensions have adjustable collars, thus you can adjust the springs to the load carried .... not that I have ever seen anybody adjust a spring between trips .... at least it does offer the flexibility to adjust the suspension as the springs sag over it life span.


Something else to consider - have the steering allignment set BEFORE you have suspension fitted, and with no load in the vehicle. Then have the suspension fitted and have the allignment done again - WATCH that screen and see how the allignment has gone for a ball .... Now go home and LOAD the vehicle for a long trip, go back for a third time to have the suspension set ... SCARY when you see how much the suspension settings change from no load to fully loaded. I fitted the canopy and the daily load, thus everything except the water, food and clothes for our trips, then had the suspension set according to this load. Tires never wore skew. :thumbup:

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Sun Jul 31, 2016 3:24 pm

The local brand that no-one can seem to remember is MikeM Suspensions. Good product with excellent service, before and after sales. Speak to Darryl Dockray - (he is also a member here with usermane "Mikem 1").

Personally I am still biased towards Old Man Emu because of my experience with the brand as an excellent all-rounder with long term reliability. Not the cheapest setup available by any means, but worth it IMO.

When making your choice consider that a suspension upgrade is the single most important modification to an off-roader - it overshadows everything else. So do some research while considering your intended use for the vehicle and make an informed decision. :winkx:
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ChrisF
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Sun Jul 31, 2016 6:20 pm

Mud Dog wrote:The local brand that no-one can seem to remember is MikeM Suspensions. Good product with excellent service, before and after sales. Speak to Darryl Dockray - (he is also a member here with usermane "Mikem 1").

Personally I am still biased towards Old Man Emu because of my experience with the brand as an excellent all-rounder with long term reliability. Not the cheapest setup available by any means, but worth it IMO.

When making your choice consider that a suspension upgrade is the single most important modification to an off-roader - it overshadows everything else. So do some research while considering your intended use for the vehicle and make an informed decision. :winkx:
SO TRUE !!

Even the best brand wont work if you buy the wrong system for your intended use.

The supplier really need to know if you are going to be adding aftermarket bumpers, winhes, etc .....

Antony
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Tue Aug 02, 2016 4:41 pm

Hi Lads

Thanks very much for you experienced knowledgeable input.
It's tough to understand the differences between all the different options.
I get that it's as per individual set up and carry weight and that instillation trust is in the hands of the installer. (Disturbed to hear that there are so many breakdowns as a result of bad instillation.)

I looked at the OME Bp 51s./ Pricey bunch of kit.

I'm looking for ride height and shocks that are reliable and perform well.

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ChrisF
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Tue Aug 02, 2016 6:01 pm

Antony clearly this IS going to cost a "bit" of money.

Do yourself a favour, take drive out to Stikland Industrial area and meet up with Johan Tires at First Allignment Centre - phone ahead and make sure when he will be available.

Just TALK to him. Look at his hands - he checks the vehicles before it rolls out his place !! He takes pride in his craftmanship.


Not to worry. There ARE many DECENT installations that gives years and years of excellent service.

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Tue Aug 02, 2016 6:02 pm

The OME shocks are excellent, but Monroe are also good and so are Gabriel Safari with the two latter being a fraction of the price, not only because of quality grade but also because of the import dues on the OME stuff.

Where it gets a bit tricky is increasing the ride height on the front suspension (independent) - you are limited with what can be achieved safely unless you do a diff drop where things start to get a little more involved. The front half shafts are relatively short, so any height increase dramatically effects the angles that they will be required to work at, and of course the CV's will be the limiting factor of those angles.

I think you should be able to do a 50mm lift in front without any problems, but once you go past that I think you are going to be pushing it. 50mm might not sound like much, but you will see a marked difference in appearance as well as approach / departure angles.

Of course you can supplement the height gain a bit by fitting larger profile tyres, but then you also run into problems where the wheel fouls against the foot-well (and possibly fenders is you go too wide) under full lock and articulation.

You have to ask yourself what you're looking to achieve - a competition vehicle, a trail vehicle or and overlander, and then compare that against your budget as well. :winkx:
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
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ChrisF
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Tue Aug 02, 2016 6:36 pm

Andy with the Vigo the trick is not so much the "lift" as proper "long travel" shocks.


On Elders I had a set of Ironman that lifted the nose to create a level stance, thus probably only about 30 to 40mm lift.

But the shocks were properly matched and resulted in nice long travel for the suspension.


I often got comments from onlookers about the articulation.

Okay, not competion type articulation, but it had more than enough travel for any trail we did.
Gizela-196 (Small).jpg
The photo flattens out this section ... most of the vehicles in our group bottomed out on this section. Elders idled through effortlessly :cooldude:
Chris and Greta-181 (Small).jpg

Antony
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Fri Aug 05, 2016 3:25 pm

All great useful information. I'll go chat with Johan Tires and see where that takes me.

Thanks so much for all the input.

Antony
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Sun Aug 14, 2016 4:28 pm

So, after searching and information hunting I've fitted the OME BP51s. They seem worth the cash. Good ride height, adjustable, strong, responsive and long lasting. I had to cut down my money tree for this mod but knowing suspension is the most important mod I figured I needed them. Only live once and all that.

Thanks all for your input.

I'm looking forward to taking them through their paces.

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Mon Aug 15, 2016 7:04 am

Awesome !! :thumbup:
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!

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ChrisF
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Mon Aug 15, 2016 8:02 am

ENJOY !! :)

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coetzer94
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Mon Aug 15, 2016 8:31 am

Wow, only heard good things about them! Pics?
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LouisZ
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Mon Aug 15, 2016 9:12 am

:thumbup: They far most excellent for what you need. Those really performs outstanding. Enjoy!!!

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