SFA Hilux V8 Build

grips · Post by **grips** » Sun Mar 22, 2015 2:09 pm

: SAM_0244.JPG (88.07 KiB) Viewed 19085 times

I am into conversions since owning my first 4x4 back in the mid 80`s.
Used to own a few Toyota`s which included three SFA Hilux`s.
A few months ago my son bought a SFA with a 2.8 Cressida engine.
It runs fine but lack the power we are used to.

Started studying all Toyota options, like the 2JZ GTE and Lexus conversions.
Soon dropped the 2JZ GTE options due to limited space for inter coolers.
Wanted to keep it pure Toyota I opted for a IUZ VVTI. Think this is a nice route to go.
After long nights of research I was sure Lexus were the way to go. Even had a
Cam shop lined up to cut the cams to a more 4x4 friendly profile.

Knowing quite a few friends with Lexus Conversions which I did not studied in detail I began fiscally
inspecting existing conversions. Taking as most of them for drives when ever permitted.
The Lexus engines are cheap and economical to run. Doing the conversion myself makes it quite a profitable attraction.

Ok now please do not get me wrong I have nothing against a Lexus. My biggest problem being the cramped engine bay with
a Lexus fitted. I just hate struggling in cramped spaces. Got very big questions about the aftermarket exhaust manifolds
available to give enough clearance. They will definetly cost you a few horses.

Being quite familiar with Yankee V8`s especially Ford we decided to go the ford 302 v8 route.
Yes modifying the 302 will push cost up significantly but we will have more access in the engine bay.

So I am going to build a 250kw and 500nm Ford 302 v8 for the Hilux. If the need arises we can push power to 300kw
with minor modifications
Upgrading the drive train will be part of the build.
Plan to convert a W58 Supra box to 4x4.
Also modified diff housings to accommodate 60 Series Cruiser diff`s. 35" tyres might just find their way under the
Hilux in the near future.

Post by **Family_Dog** » Sun Mar 22, 2015 4:01 pm

Hilux guys cannot read very well, so we will need plenty of pics please, Mr. Grips.

This sounds like a most interesting build!

-F_D

KOBUSL · Post by **KOBUSL** » Sun Mar 22, 2015 8:01 pm

Ons hou hierdie inskrywing met aandag dop. Vertel alles asb.

4x4BEES · Post by **4x4BEES** » Sun Mar 22, 2015 8:13 pm

Sounds amazing, keep us posted

Froll · Post by **Froll** » Sun Mar 22, 2015 9:06 pm

grips · Post by **grips** » Sun Mar 22, 2015 9:49 pm

I have build quite a few Ford v8`s in the past. My American Ranger is running a 347 v8. That is a 302 stroked out to 5.7l (347)
doing around 300kw an 600nm. The thing about Yankee v8`s is that they have everything on the shelf. You can almost build a
engine to suite your needs.

Unfortunately the next step for a Lexus is turbo charging. A 4.7l stroker kit for the Lexus cost around R80 000.00
With a standard Lexus there is not much left to do to extract extra power.

You can build a nice 302 doing 400hp (300kw) and around 500nm for less than Lexus stroker kit.

In the future if we need more power and torque we can stroke out the 302 (5.0l) to 347 (5.7l)
What tilted the scale towards the 302 is its sheer compactness.

Here is a link and a pic of a 302 SFA Hilux look at the space available, you can even fit a set of proper branches.

http://www.yotatech.com/f116/347-v8-4ru ... ndex2.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Wikkels · Post by **Wikkels** » Sun Mar 22, 2015 9:57 pm

Ekt 'n vermoede gehad dat Oom die Ford V8 roete gaan vat. Ek kannie wag om die eind resultate te sien nie! Ek weet hy gaan 'n monster Hilux wees!

Huismoeles · Post by **Huismoeles** » Sun Mar 22, 2015 9:58 pm

Daai's nou mooi

grips · Post by **grips** » Sun Mar 22, 2015 10:09 pm

Wikkels wrote:Ekt 'n vermoede gehad dat Oom die Ford V8 roete gaan vat. Ek kannie wag om die eind resultate te sien nie! Ek weet hy gaan 'n monster Hilux wees!

William Jy ken my te goed. Glo my ek het my huiswerk baie goed oor die Lexus gedoen en sou graag daai roete wou gaan.
Soos jy my ken die eerste keer dat ek sukkel om my hand iewers in te kry is ek oppad hel toe.

En ja om krag uit die ou gietyster goed te toor is net so maklik.

Kyk so `n bietjie hoe maklik reageer die 302 op modifikasies.

http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/140 ... kyard-302/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Tjomma · Post by **Tjomma** » Sun Mar 22, 2015 11:08 pm

Hie kom perre

Goodluck oom, ek hou dop met antisipasie

Post by **Mud Dog** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 7:12 am

Sounds like a interesting build project - will be watching this thread!

You're gonna have to do a serious brake upgrade as well to reign in those horses!

The Legend · Post by **The Legend** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 7:26 pm

Christo

Daardie V8 is seker heelwat swaarder in gewig as die V8 Lexus?

Wikkels · Post by **Wikkels** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 9:12 pm

grips wrote:
Wikkels wrote:Ekt 'n vermoede gehad dat Oom die Ford V8 roete gaan vat. Ek kannie wag om die eind resultate te sien nie! Ek weet hy gaan 'n monster Hilux wees!
William Jy ken my te goed. Glo my ek het my huiswerk baie goed oor die Lexus gedoen en sou graag daai roete wou gaan.
Soos jy my ken die eerste keer dat ek sukkel om my hand iewers in te kry is ek oppad #hel toe.

En ja om krag uit die ou gietyster goed te toor is net so maklik.

Kyk so `n bietjie hoe maklik reageer die 302 op modifikasies.

http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/140 ... kyard-302/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

grips · Post by **grips** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 9:20 pm

Lollie wrote:Christo

Daardie V8 is seker heelwat swaarder in gewig as die V8 Lexus?

`n 302 AFR aluminium heads weeg 187kg.

Die Lexus is so 10kg ligter teen 177kg.

Vandag die 302 wat in my stoor staan gestrip. Hy is nog standaard. Gaan hom laat uitboor tot so .030" oor maat.

Die idee is om `n soort gelyke enjin te bou wat tans in een van my Rangers is.

AFR silinderkoppe is `n moet. Gaan ook H-Beam conrods met Keith Black pistons gebruik.

Hier is so `n paar foto`s van my twee V8 Rangers se enjins. Die die blou 347 en die swart 302.

Wikkels · Post by **Wikkels** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 9:31 pm

As ek eendag groot is.............

grips · Post by **grips** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 9:33 pm

Wikkels wrote:Ekt 'n vermoede gehad dat Oom die Ford V8 roete gaan vat. Ek kannie wag om die eind resultate te sien nie! Ek weet hy gaan 'n monster Hilux wees!

William jy sal darem `n slag jou profiel moet opgradeer. Ou Bloues is mos al lankal vervang met `n SFA Hilux . En daai Colt is al vervang met drie ander bakkies.

Wikkels · Post by **Wikkels** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 9:56 pm

grips wrote:
Wikkels wrote:Ekt 'n vermoede gehad dat Oom die Ford V8 roete gaan vat. Ek kannie wag om die eind resultate te sien nie! Ek weet hy gaan 'n monster Hilux wees!
William jy sal darem `n slag jou profiel moet opgradeer. Ou Bloues is mos al lankal vervang met `n SFA Hilux . En daai Colt is al vervang met drie ander bakkies.

Daai twee voertuie is waarop my voertuig fondamente gebou is! Oom weet mos hoe erg was ek oor hulle! One of a kind!

The Legend · Post by **The Legend** » Tue Mar 24, 2015 5:01 am

Christo

Darem mooi V8 engines daardie. Wat kos hulle deesdae?

grips · Post by **grips** » Tue Mar 24, 2015 5:16 am

Lollie wrote:Christo

Darem mooi V8 engines daardie. Wat kos hulle deesdae?

Dawie ek hoop nie my vrou lees hier nie. Om `n ordentlike enjin te bou kos jou teen die huidige Rand/Dollar so tussen R50000.00 en R80 000.00. Die duurste item is die Aluminium silinderkoppe. Jy kry heel wat verskillende make van hulle.
Ek verkies egter AFR`S wat tans so R11 000.00 per silinderkop kos. Dit klink baie maar koop maar een vir `n moderne voertiug en jy kyk in die omgewing van R16000.00

Ek roei al met v8`s sedert 1986 so ek het baie part wat my boukoste aansienlik verlaag.

4x4BEES · Post by **4x4BEES** » Tue Mar 24, 2015 7:37 am

Darem niks mooier as V8 nie

grips · Post by **grips** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:44 am

Die beplanning rond om die Hilux vorder goed. Ratverhoudings en v8 enjins loop hand aan hand.
Hoë torsie enjins vra sulke lekker lang ratte.

Meeste van my ombouings is Amerikaanse voertuie waar rat keuses bykans onbeperk is.
Op my 347 Ranger het ek Dana Diff`s gebruik wat jy `n verhouding vir amper elke situasie kry.
Vir die Ranger het ek `n splitter voor op die ratkas gesit wat effektief 8 rat verhoudings gee.
Die 302 Ranger het ek `n Borg Warner T5 gebruik wat ek omgebou het na 4x4. Die ratkas het oor die 30 verkillende ratverhoudings bekikbaar. Ek het `n Mustang gearset gebruik wat lekker pas by die v8 se krag en torsie.

Van die begin af het ek besef dat die SFA Hilux verhoudings nie eintlik v8 vriendelik is nie.
My gear ratio calculator lam gespeel en uiteindelik iets gekry wat behoort te werk.
Sal ongelukkig `n kombinasie van ratkaste moet wees .
Ek kan `n W58 in die hande kry. So ons gaan `n lekker baster ratkas bou uit `n kombinasie van W54 ,R150 en R154 onderdele.

Sy verhoudings behoort as volg te lyk. Die spoed teen 6000rpm deur die ratte is agter gevoeg.
Ook die spoed teen 120 in 5de rat.
Berekeninge gedoen met die 32 duim bande war tans onder die bakkie is. Dit gaan in die toekoms met 35`s vervang word
Top spoed of 5de rat berekening is net teoreties en ek glo nie daaraan om met `n 4x4 te jaag nie.

W58

First Gear: 3.285:1 = 57km/h
Second Gear: 1.894:1 = 100
Third Gear: 1.275:1 = 147
Fourth Gear: 1.00:1 = 188
Fifth Gear: 0.753:1 = 251
Reverse: -3.768:1
Enjin spoed teen 120km/h = 2880

R151

First Gear: 4.313:1 = 44km/h
Second Gear: 2.330:1 = 69
Third Gear: 1.436:1 = 98
Fourth Gear: 1.00:1 = 188
Fifth Gear: 0.838:1 = 227
Enjin spoed teen 120 km/h = 3200

grips · Post by **grips** » Fri Apr 24, 2015 9:09 pm

En daar blaas die 2.8 top gasket. Klaar die top getrek gaan hom eers reg maak maar gaan definitief die v8 ombouing so `n bietjie
op spoed.

grips · Post by **grips** » Sun May 10, 2015 1:51 pm

En nou hou die Patroltjie ons eers `n bietjie besig.

Wikkels · Post by **Wikkels** » Sun May 10, 2015 3:08 pm

Die Patrol kom mooi aan Oom. Hy sal darem mooi lyk in wit. Soos Oom altyd sê:"two tone.... wit onder en wit bo!"

grips · Post by **grips** » Sun May 10, 2015 7:36 pm

Wikkels wrote:Die Patrol kom mooi aan Oom. Hy sal darem mooi lyk in wit. Soos Oom altyd sê:"two tone.... wit onder en wit bo!"

William ja ek het ongelukkig geen sê in die kleur nie. Jou klein nefie het al van Oranje tot Kaki in gedagte gehad. Ek sorg vir die meganiese en tegniese goed die bakwerk en kleur moet hy uitsorteer.

Hoppy · Post by **Hoppy** » Wed May 13, 2015 12:06 am

Die Ford v8 werk mooi in die sfa, die R series box van n Kzte sal net so pas en die torque mooi hanteer, die diff senters van n 3.0 d4d pas ook net so voor en agter en sorteer die ratios heeltemaal uit, vir n bonus het hulle nog lockers ook.

grips · Post by **grips** » Wed May 13, 2015 6:37 am

Hoppy wrote:Die Ford v8 werk mooi in die sfa, die R series box van n Kzte sal net so pas en die torque mooi hanteer, die diff senters van n 3.0 d4d pas ook net so voor en agter en sorteer die ratios heeltemaal uit, vir n bonus het hulle nog lockers ook.

Dankie Alan ek gaan nog julle Hilux kenners se kennis tap

Hoppy · Post by **Hoppy** » Wed May 13, 2015 8:45 am

As jy met amerikaanse V8's werk, sal jy weet dat n Chev V8 baie meer olie lek as n Ford V8, ek hou van my Ford V8's, al is hy bietjie duurder om te bou as n chevy.

Ek het hierdie een se 302 meer as 5 jaar gelede gebou, na baie track days lek hy nog nie n druppel nie.

: _MG_1079 (Small).JPG (72.5 KiB) Viewed 18658 times

grips · Post by **grips** » Wed May 13, 2015 10:59 am

Hoppy wrote:As jy met amerikaanse V8's werk, sal jy weet dat n Chev V8 baie meer olie lek as n Ford V8, ek hou van my Ford V8's, al is hy bietjie duurder om te bou as n chevy.

Ek het hierdie een se 302 meer as 5 jaar gelede gebou, na baie track days lek hy nog nie n druppel nie.

_MG_1079 (Small).JPG

Daai is nou baie pragtig. Nog altyd oor `n GT40 gedroom. Allan die Ford Chev debat sal seker nooit ophou nie. Dit is duurder om krag uit `n Ford enjin te haal as uit `n Chevy maar aai `n Fordjie kan jy darem lekker toor. Ek weet dit is sekser niks nuut vir jou nie maar cc vir cc skop die Fordjies `n Chevy se gat.

`n Paar interresante artikels.

http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/116 ... e-buildup/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Kyk hier op die Edelbrock sit wat maak `n 347 Ford maak meer perde as `n 350 Chevy

http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/mc/ ... main.shtml" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/mc/ ... main.shtml" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Hoppy · Post by **Hoppy** » Wed May 13, 2015 2:10 pm

Die Ford pas maklikker in die Hilux want sy dizzy sit voor, jy kan die enjin ver genoeg terugskuif sodat die visco fan kan inkom, gebruik die kort neus waterpomp. Die Chevy se starter is ook in die pad van die tramp rod. Gilo engineering verkoop n bell housing wat op die Toyota box pas.

grips · Post by **grips** » Fri May 15, 2015 4:50 pm

Lyk my daar is `n paar manne wat adaptors vir die RA1F na die R150F maak.
Het al besigheid met Advance Adapters in die States gedoen.

Sal seker ook nie te moelik wees om self te maak nie.

grips · Post by **grips** » Thu Jun 11, 2015 5:51 am

Ons begin ernstig daarna kyk om dalk `n stel Dana 44`s onder die Hilux in te glip. Die rede hier voor is dat daar dalk 35`s dalk sy voorland gaan wees.Ook sal die ekstra breedte van die Dana`s van voordeel wees in `n geligte voertuig.
Nou net vir `n stel Jeep Wagoneer aste.

En wie weet dalk stroke ons nog daai 302 na 347. As die 347 roete gekies word dan het die Hilux so 300kw en 600nm.
Elke keer as ek die artikel lees raak die lus vir `n stroker al groter.

Teen 3000rpm doen die 347 reeds 200kw en 520nm, dit is mos nou wat `n man in `n 4x4 soek.

http://www.fourwheeler.com/how-to/engin ... co-engine/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

grips · Post by **grips** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 10:10 am

Net voordar almal dink ons doen niks. Nog besig met die Patrol so die Hilux drink aan die agterspeen.

Besig om te kyk na opsies om `n 6 spoed T56 ratkas op die Hilux t-case te sit. Die T56 is `n v8 ratkas en sy verhoudings gaan baie beter op die 302 werk. Ook is 5de an 6de rat beide over drives.

So iets.

Thabogrobler · Post by **Thabogrobler** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 3:49 pm

Sjoe, dit klink lekker!

Waar kom daai 6 spoed kas vandaan?

grips · Post by **grips** » Tue Nov 10, 2015 5:11 pm

Ek het die Hilux se ombouing vanaf Feb haarfyn bestudeer. Eerstens is die Hilux se kondisie amper so goed soos nuut. Dit is my oudste seun se hart se punt, ook sy daaglikse vevoermiddel.

Na baie wik en weeg het hy besluit om die Hilux so naby aan standaard as moontlik te hou. Ook wil hy die volle werking van sy lugreeling behou en soek ook plek vir kragstuur olie verkoeler.

Ek sou bitter graag die 5.0l v8 roete wil gaan maar dit gaan beteken dat ratkas en diffs opgradeer moet word. Ongelukkig bied Toyota nie vreeslike wye keuses van diffs wat 500nm plus kan hanteer nie.
Die Lexus opsie bly net eenvoudig vir ons te beknop.

Die wens is ook dat hy graag by `n Toyota enjin wil bly. Ek en Willied het met `n onlangse 4x4 trippie so bietjie
oor v6 enjins gesels.

Besluit om `n 5vz 3.4 Prado in die Hilux te sit. Sien hier op die forum dit is al `n paar maal in die verlede gedoen.
As `n mens so `n bietjie speel met die throttle body, gas flow van heads, branches en `n free flow behoort jy die 5vz se krag en torque so `n bietjie aan te jaag. Ek glo dat jy die standaard 142kw en 298 nm so in die omgewing van 150 tot 160kw en 310 tot 320nm kan druk.

Die v6 gaan genoeg spasie vir al die bybehore gee en onder bonnet temperature gaan nie `n problem wees nie.
Sien ook daar is meer as genoeg spasie vir `n visco waaier.

As sy gat juk vir `n v8 hier is gelukkig vier op die werf.

grips · Post by **grips** » Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:24 pm

Die Patrol is so amper amper klaar nou begin ons ernstig in die Hilux se rigting loer.

Sal seker 5VZ met Prado ratkas op R1AF oordrakas wees.
Dink net hierdie ombouing gaan die Hilux perfek pas. Een groot voordeel is dat alle onderdele oor
die rak by die agente beskikbaar gaan wees.

Ons loer ook na so `n paar modifikasies om ekstra perde uit te toor. Met die nodige moeite behoort `n ou nie te vêr van `n 1uz se krag en torsie af te kom nie.

Ons sien regtig uit na die projek, sou bitter graag die Ford v8 roete wou gaan maar die Hilux se baas wil hom Toyota hou

grips · Post by **grips** » Fri Nov 20, 2015 11:54 am

Paar oulike goedtjies vir die 5VZ beskikbaar.

http://www.lceperformance.com/searchres ... mit=Submit

Veral daai 10:1 pistons trek my aandag. En dan as jy hom 0.04 oor boor vergroot jy hom na 3.5l. Volgens wat ek lees reageer hy baie goed op gasvloei. Die manne reken jy kan so tussen 15 en 20kw daardeur alleen wen.

Sal so `n bietjie later die 5VZ op my Desk Top Dyno invoer. My voorspelling is dat jy so binne 20 tot 30 kw en newtons van `n 1UZ Lexus af gaan stop.

Hoe meer ek navorsing doen hoe beter lyk ons besluit.

JohanW · Post by **JohanW** » Fri Nov 20, 2015 2:44 pm

Hierdie build gaan stout raak bitter vinnig. Sien uit om die fotos te sien. <wink wink> :D

grips · Post by **grips** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 5:23 pm

Die naweek aan `n 4x4 Pretdag deel geneem. Daar was `n groot verskeidenheid 4x4`s.
Lekker tegniese duine met kort aanlope.

Onder hulle `n nuwe Hilux D4D en `n SFA Hilux met Lexus v8 enjins.
Daar was ook `n standaard Hilux 4.0l v6 en `n 45 Cruiser met `n 4.0l v6 Toyota enjin.
Alhoewel die standaard 4.0l Hilux kleiner bande as die Lexus Hiluxe gehad het, het hy hulle ore aangesit.
So ook die 45 Cruiser met die v6. Nogal `n interresante vergelyking gewees.

V8 D4D Cruiser het al die ander Toyotas pakslae gegee, ook die Lexus en v6 Toyotas.

grips · Post by **grips** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 5:51 am

Thanks to Drikus here on the forum we now have a 1GR-FE 4.0L v6. Think this engine is the best option for the SFA Hilux.

With a twist of fate my two sons bought a Lexus powered Hilux in company yesterday. So now another SFA joins the family. The Lexus conversion was done in a very crappy way. We will redo the whole conversion.

Think some fun times ahead at the end we can do a neck to neck test between the IGR-FE and the 1UZ.

JohanW · Post by **JohanW** » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:17 am

Lekker man, Oom grips gooi daar 'n paar kiekies van die 3.4 asb. As dit enige iets is soos die ander ombouings behoort dit nog 'n meesterstuk te wees.

grips · Post by **grips** » Thu Apr 21, 2016 12:53 pm

Die Hilux se baas is af tussen sy simesters en nou geniet die Hilux al sy aandag.

My probleem met die Lexus in die Hilux is die breedte van die enjin. In die meeste ombouings wat ek al aanskou het is daar maar weinig spasie tussen die Lexus power steering pomp en die Hilux steering box.

Christopher het besluit om die battery `n nuwe rusplek te gee. `n Nuwe bracket vir die steering box te bou deur dit so 12mm te laat sak en 40mm na buite te skuif.

Knuppel · Post by **Knuppel** » Thu Apr 21, 2016 7:36 pm

Maar daar by die steering box verstaan ek nie nou so lekker wat aan die gang is nie! Het hulle hom sonder power steering gery?

grips · Post by **grips** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 5:13 am

Marius jy is 100% korrek. Die Lexus ombouing wat tans in die bakkie is, is seker die beste voorbeeld van hoe `n ombouing nie gedoen moet word nie. Hierdie is `n tipiese voorbeeld hoe om `n voertuig te verwoes en nie te verbeter nie.

My seun beplan om alles oor te doen.

Knuppel · Post by **Knuppel** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:27 am

Ek sien uit daarna om te sien hoe julle hom reg ruk.

Post by **Gert Greeff** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 1:50 pm

Jy kry net nooit die kind wees uit jou uit nie.....net die speelgoed raak duurder.
Niks so mooi soos ń V8 se dreuning.
Sterkte met die ombouing

Sent from my GT-I9190 using Tapatalk

grips · Post by **grips** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 5:26 pm

We made a decision on the gearbox and transfer case. Going hybrid a mix of the Aisin family find in Jeeps and Toyota`s.

The 10 spline input shaft of the AX15 will make it possible to use a proper v8 clutch assy from a Ford 302 on the Lexus v8.

The AX15, R150, R151 and the R154 from the Supra all have interchangeable
gear clusters. The idea is to run R154 cluster with the R150 5th gear ratio or R150 cluster with R452 5th gear ratio.
The R154 have a cluster ratio of 1.117 and the R150 1.482.
Using the R150 5th gear ratio with the R154 cluster will give you a 5th gear ratio of 0.674 or 0.69 using the R150 cluster with R452 5th gear. This will help cruising speed with the high standard gear 4.88 ratios of the Hilux diff.
Also the longer Supra ratios will aid to the performance of the Lexus v8.

When using the AX15 tail housing on a R150 will make the use of American gear driven transfer cases. NP 205 and Dana 20 possible

For us the most crucial part of a build is to get the driving train strong enough and the proper ratios to suite the engine.

Post by **Mud Dog** » Wed Apr 27, 2016 3:08 am

[quote/]For us the most crucial part of a build is to get the driving train strong enough and the proper ratios to suite the engine.[quote]

Don't forget to factor in the wheel / tyre diameters if you go bigger.

grips · Post by **grips** » Wed Apr 27, 2016 6:40 am

Mud Dog wrote:
[quote/]
For us the most crucial part of a build is to get the driving train strong enough and the proper ratios to suite the engine.

Don't forget to factor in the wheel / tyre diameters if you go bigger.

That is very true in person I think 33`s are the limit on import SFA diff`s

The Lexus conversion take the standard SFA running gear way over its design limits.
Read somewhere that the R151 box designed torque limit is 300nm.

I have build many 4x4`s including American and Japanese vehicles. Our biggest problem in SA is that there were never any Toyota`s manufactured here that have engines doing over 500nm in Factory trim. Only FJ 45 and 80 series Cruiser diff`s and the H55 Cruiser box will handle it. Problem is that the offset diff`s on the Cruiser make swopping it into a SFA quite a mission.

Buffel · Post by **Buffel** » Wed Apr 27, 2016 8:06 am

Sterkte Christo lyk my jul gaan besig bly vir n ruk

Buffel · Post by **Buffel** » Wed Apr 27, 2016 8:11 am

Ek weet van n V10 Toy Engine,het hom wel nog nie gesien nie,maar wag in spanning vir die man nog, ek sal graag wil sie hoe klein die spasie in n SFA sal wees as ek hom in die single cab sit

Agteros · Post by **Agteros** » Thu Apr 28, 2016 11:14 am

grips wrote:
Mud Dog wrote:
[quote/]
For us the most crucial part of a build is to get the driving train strong enough and the proper ratios to suite the engine.

Don't forget to factor in the wheel / tyre diameters if you go bigger.
That is very true in person I think 33`s are the limit on import SFA diff`s

The Lexus conversion take the standard SFA running gear way over its design limits.
Read somewhere that the R151 box designed torque limit is 300nm.

I have build many 4x4`s including American and Japanese vehicles. Our biggest problem in SA is that there were never any Toyota`s manufactured here that have engines doing over 500nm in Factory trim. Only FJ 45 and 80 series Cruiser diff`s and the H55 Cruiser box will handle it. Problem is that the offset diff`s on the Cruiser make swopping it into a SFA quite a mission.

Christo kan dit wees? Ek het die V6 Fortuner gery en hy maak 343nm met die R151 ratkas?

grips · Post by **grips** » Thu Apr 28, 2016 1:23 pm

Hugo hou in gedagte dat die R151 in 1986 ontwerp is. Ek weet van `n paar gevalle waar hulle agter kragtige enjins geneig is om 2de en 5de rat vaarwel te roep.
Ek voel maar net veilig om `n ratkas binne sy oorspronklike spesifkasies te gebruik.
Ford het destyds dieselfde met dieBorg Warner T5 gedoen en hom uit gebring agter enjins wat sy perke oorskry.
Ek het so `n 4x4 weergawe met Mustang binnegoed in my 302 v8 Ranger. Juis die krag van die enjin beperk om binne die ratkas se spesifikasies te bly.

Tog hoor ons van R151`s in 4.2 Diesel Cruisers en so af en toe in D4D`s wat probleme gee.

Dalk help hierdie `n beitjie.

The G- and W-series front transmission housings both have the same bolt pattern, so their bellhousings are interchangeable.

With that said, the stock Tacoma W59 bellhousing is used on any type of G- or W-series transmission, which all have the same input shaft spline count (21), length, and pilot. So the W59 Tacoma bellhousing allows for a G52, G54, and W56 to be bolted directly behind a 'RZ' engine block.

Now as for your G-series transmission, which is a G52, or the *weakest* aluminum 4WD 5-speed transmission ever used by Toyota, I HIGHLY recommend AGAINST using it or any other G-series transmission behind *especially* the 3RZ. Remember that the 3RZ has nearly the same torque output as a 3.0l V6, and putting a G52 transmission behind a 3.0 in a heavy 1995 4Runner is not something Toyota would have done.

In fact, when we did Bevin's 3RZ Swap, we swapped a 2003 3RZ into his Carburated (G54) 1985 Shortbed, and right now that transmission is on its LAST LEG. After our run up at Bald Mtn this past weekend, Bevin told me that if he doesn't get a better transmission by Christmas, he doesn't think his G54 will last into 2007. His Transmission is making so much noise that you can't even drive it above 80 MPH. The whole truck shakes and it feels like something is going to blow up. If you put it in 4th gear it sounds better, but I am sure that both his main bearings and especially the counter and 5th gear bearings have about had it.

~180 ft-lbs torque is NOT what the G-series transmission was designed for. Remember that the original Hilux G-series transmission used (the G52) was offered with an engine that only had a maximum torque output of just 129 ft-lbs.

The W56 is a lot better than the G52 and a bit better than the G54. Toyota did use the W-series transmission behind the 5M-GE power plants of the 1981+ Celica Supra, but remember that the early US-version of the fuel injected 2.8l 5M, the engine used with the first 5-speed in the W-series, the W50, developed but just 145 ft-lbs torque, or about 35 ft-lbs LESS than the 3RZ. This 5M is much more comparable to the fuel injected 22R-E, which was also fitted with a W-series transmission (the W56 of course), rated about 140 ft-lbs torque.

So when you look at how Toyota introduced the transmissions, then you can understand what they had in mind:

Transmission Introduced Engine Used Year Torque Rating
L-series (L43) 20R 1979 122 ft-lbs
L-series (L45) 22R 1981 122 ft-lbs
L-series (L50) 22R 1981 129 ft-lbs
L-series (L52) 22R 1983 129 ft-lbs
G-series (G52) 22R 1984 129 ft-lbs
G-series (G54) 22R 1985 129 ft-lbs
W-series (W56) 22R-E 1985 137 ft-lbs
R-series (R151F) 22R-TE 1986 173 ft-lbs

Also, other Toyota models include, but not limited to:
Transmission Introduced Engine Used Year Torque Rating Notes
G50 2KD-FTV (diesel) 199? 147 ft-lbs Very high TQ rating for the G
First W-series (W50) 5M-GE 1981 145 ft-lbs 2WD Celica Supra, Curb Weight ~3000lbs
First R-series (R150) 3VZ-E 1988 180 ft-lbs 2WD V6 Hilux. R150 is the first in the series,
but the R151 was introduced
two years prior in the
2WD 22R-TE models

Now some like to say that Toyota "Over Engineers there vehicles", and I believe this as well, but when you compare what the transmissions were originally intended for with the torque ratings of future engines used, it is quite evident that Toyota in fact did Over Engineer their transmission, and this is evident in the W-series:

W-Series fact of "Over Engineered"
Engine Model Year Torque Rating Vehicle Weight
Originally used behind a 5M-GE, 2.8l I6 W50, Celica Supra 1981 145 ft-lbs ~3000 lbs
Retired with use behind a 3RZ-FE, 2.7l I4 W59, Tacoma 2004 177 ft-lbs ~3400 lbs (Crew Cab)

So Toyota used the same series transmission in a vehicle (the Tacoma) that weighs apprx. 400 pounds more behind an engine that develops apprx. 35 more ft-lbs of torque than compared to the Celica Supra, which was the original vehicle used with the W-series transmission.

Now if we hold this same truth of the W-series transmission to the G-series transmission, then the "Degree of Over Engineering" required for the G-series transmission would only allow an engine of about 165 ft-lbs of torque (add 35 ft-lbs to the 1984 G52 setup). And this is only true if the G-transmission is as well built as the W-transmission, which we know it is not.

So even if we consider Toyota over engineering the G-series transmission, I would say that they would only suggest its use with engines up to 160 ft-lbs of torque. The 3RZ-FE is therefore nearly 20 ft-lbs of torque too much for the G-series transmission to be used in a "reliable" nature, if one follows my bizzar method described here.

Perhaps even more evident, but not related to our discussion, is the degree of Over Engineering of the 5-speed R-series. In this case, a 400 lb heavier vehicle is fitted with an engine that produces nearly 50 ft-lbs torque more than in the original case:
Engine Model Year Torque Rating Vehicle Weight
Originally used behind a 22R-TE, 2.4l I4 R151F, Hilux 1986 173 ft-lbs ~3000 lbs
Retired with use behind a 5VZ-FE, 3.4l V6 R150F, Tacoma 2004 220 ft-lbs ~3400 lbs
Optional Dealer Installation behind a 5VZ-FZE, TRD Supercharged 3.4l V6 R150F, Tacoma 1996-04 ~300 ft-lbs ~3400 lbs

So you can buy a R-series equipped Supercharged Tacoma with a factory warrenty that exceeds the original use of the R-transmission in a Toyota truck by a good 125 ft-lbs of torque. Now that is saying something about the R-series transmission. That says something that no L-, G-, or W-series transmission could even dream about!

Agteros · Post by **Agteros** » Thu Apr 28, 2016 4:43 pm

Thx vir die interessante inligting Christo. Ja diep hier in my hart is ek maar bly ek die Fortuner laat loop toe ek het. Net ingeval die 5de sou gegroet het.

grips · Post by **grips** » Mon May 02, 2016 8:31 am

We got hold of a R151 from a Prado. Plan to swop out the 5th gear ratio with one from a R452 gearbox.
This will give us a nice cruising ratio of 120km/h at 2500rpm with the 33`s.

Have not made final decisions about the t-case. I like the fact that the Prado have an AWD gear driven t-case.

AX15 input shaft idea scrapped, the Lexus flywheel diameter killing the idea of fitting a proper v8 clutch kit.

Agteros · Post by **Agteros** » Mon May 02, 2016 10:47 am

Christo gaan julle nou die R151 agter die 1 UZ-FE of die 1GR-FE sit?

grips · Post by **grips** » Tue May 03, 2016 6:03 am

Hugo hy gaan agter die Lexus kom. Ons will graag eers die Lexuslux klaar maak.

grips · Post by **grips** » Sat May 07, 2016 6:30 am

We have ordered the new 5th gear ratio. In the end the gearbox is not what we thought it to be, Thought it was AWD. The actuator on the back was to select between 2wd and 4wd. A little disappointed about it being chain driven. I am sure it will be swopped out very soon.

Buffel · Post by **Buffel** » Sat May 07, 2016 6:58 am

Vir my werk die Isuzu v6 box baie beter eks glad nie lief vir kettings nie met die 35" bf's is ek op 110kmh @ 1900/2000 rpm wat Groot verskil maak met fuel consumption op langpad . Ongelukkig vir die SFA met Groot bande raak dit taamlik scary hoe Nader Jy aan 200kmh kom so ek bly maar weg van daai nommers af.

grips · Post by **grips** » Sat May 07, 2016 7:43 am

So amper "before and after" Die Hilux is besig met `n gedaante verwisseling.