1973 Chev Constantia V8

Post by **pietpetoors** » Wed Dec 30, 2015 1:40 pm

We recently bought a 1973 Chev Constantia with 308 V8.
The fuel tank was badly rusted so we had it cleaned out. I also stripped and cleaned the fuel pump and Rochester carburetor.

It had no timing marks so I determined TDC and then set the timing where I think is about 10 degrees.

Trying to get it started now.
The only way I can start it is by putting some fuel directly in the first stage of the carb.
It then starts and it idles (a bit rough but it idles)

On its own there is now way I get it started, I must put a drop or two in the first stage.
If I put it in gear it dies, as if the engine idles but do not have enough power to run the gearbox as well.

Any idea where I must start looking for the problem?

: Chev 308 V8

: Chev Constantia

swartvark · Post by **swartvark** » Wed Dec 30, 2015 2:29 pm

Jis Pieter, Daai ou metaal petrolpype roes ook maar lekker. Dalk verhoed dit ordentlike toevoer.
Koop 'n goedkoop petrolpompie en koppel hom daar voor op om te kyk of die Chevy sal aanhou loop as die pompie help met toevoer..... As dit werk, dan weet jy dis tyd vir petrolpype.

Post by **pietpetoors** » Wed Dec 30, 2015 4:01 pm

Tiaan, as hy eers start loop hy. Ek moet bietjie petrol in die keel gooi om hom te laat start. Hy vat dan dadelik. Hy idle dan en ook as ek vet gee rev hy maklik.

Is net sonder die doppie in die keel wil hy nie start nie.

Het die pyp vol petrol gemaak en geblaas voor ek opgekoppel het en hy het lekker vry geloop.

Ek weet daar sal nog bietjie roes wees, dus om te verhoed dat daar weer vuilgoed in die petrolpomp gaan het ek 'n ekstra filter voor die pomp ook gesit.

Post by **pietpetoors** » Wed Dec 30, 2015 4:06 pm

O ja en voor ek die tenk teruggesit het, het ek hom direk uit 'n jerrykan gehardloop, toe het hy dieselfde gedoen.

swartvark · Post by **swartvark** » Wed Dec 30, 2015 4:10 pm

So.........hy loop mooi tot jy hom in rat sit? Auto?

zepplin · Post by **zepplin** » Wed Dec 30, 2015 6:07 pm

Hope you get it sorted before Bull Run '16................

Post by **pietpetoors** » Wed Dec 30, 2015 8:29 pm

So.........hy loop mooi tot jy hom in rat sit? Auto?

Jip. As mens nie briek trap en jy sit hom in rat hardloop hy sommer. Voel amper of ratkas nie vry loop, stram is, .. of so iets.

Post by **bduk** » Wed Dec 30, 2015 10:34 pm

From your picture i see what is wrong...........

The distributor is on the wrong side of the engine.

pampoen · Post by **pampoen** » Thu Dec 31, 2015 5:25 pm

Check your timing again. Open and clean carb pro around properly. It's always the small things that mess you around.

Post by **pietpetoors** » Thu Dec 31, 2015 6:11 pm

Thanx Luke, will take carb off again tomorrow. Started it again today and realised it was running waaaaay to rich.
Must be the carb.

Biltongman · Post by **Biltongman** » Thu Dec 31, 2015 11:06 pm

Maak jou flout level in carb kleiner.

Post by **pietpetoors** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 8:14 am

Dankie Harm, ek gaan daai probeer. Welkom by die forum.

Post by **Mud Dog** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 11:40 am

Those old Rochester 4 barrel carbs were good in their day, but can be a bugger to set up, especially if the butterfly bushes are worn.
You say running rich, but needs a manual prime to start. Is the acceleration pump working? Diaphragm OK? Auto choke working? (maybe fit manual choke).
Needle and seat not leaking? Float level?
Air and mixture settings?
Vacuum hoses / vacuum take-offs not sucking air?

Those torque converters did drag a bit .... maybe increase idle speed a bit as a quick fix.

Good luck!

Post by **pietpetoors** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 3:30 pm

Got it going, drove it around the block the first time since we bought it.

There was something rubbery in the needle and seat, thus it did not seal.

Still does not start on its own, I must either add a drop of fuel in the first stage or open the throttle all the way before it start.

Drives very comfy.

Post by **pietpetoors** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:00 pm

How old do you think this is?

: Buiteband

: Buiteband

zepplin · Post by **zepplin** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:19 pm

As old as FD & MD maybe???????

Post by **pietpetoors** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:45 pm

As old as FD & MD maybe???????

Really, you think THAT old?

The Legend · Post by **The Legend** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 5:57 pm

Pieter wys dit nie die jaar van vervaardiging op die band aan nie?

Post by **FIRSTGEER** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 10:10 pm

Manufactured a year or two before the Rinderpest !

Post by **pietpetoors** » Fri Jan 01, 2016 10:15 pm

Pieter wys dit nie die jaar van vervaardiging op die band aan nie?

Nee, behalwe as dit een of ander geheime kode is.

Post by **Mud Dog** » Sat Jan 02, 2016 4:04 am

zepplin wrote:As old as FD & MD maybe???????

Sadly Eric and I are considerably older than that vehicle

, but glad to hear that you got it going.

The acceleration pump should deliver a decent enough squirt to 'prime the carb' for starting purposes, about 3ml per squirt. A teaspoon is about 5ml so maybe two pumps of the pedal before cranking the motor.

ThysdJ · Post by **ThysdJ** » Sat Jan 02, 2016 7:47 pm

Whoaaaa... Ek het in Aussie Land met so 'n 1977 Holdentjie rondgery... Hy het my 'n volle AU$650 gekos... Dit is nog steeds een van my favourite karre van alle tye. Myne was 'n ligblou metallic Kingswood... Ja hy ry baie gemaklik.. en hy maak 'n lang pad kort.. Ek het weekliks met hom gecommute tussen Canberra en Berrigan (+/- 550km one way) sonder probleme..

Post by **Family_Dog** » Sat Jan 02, 2016 8:08 pm

Mud Dog wrote:
zepplin wrote:As old as FD & MD maybe???????
Sadly Eric and I are considerably older than that vehicle , but glad to hear that you got it going.

T'is true. In my days of youth, we had horse-drawn Roman Chariots. Used to whip 'em for speed.

-F_D

Post by **Mud Dog** » Sun Jan 03, 2016 12:11 am

Post by **pietpetoors** » Fri Feb 05, 2016 5:58 am

Last night took steering box out to have seals replaced.

Also took rear coils out to have new ones made. .

: Solution to sagging coils

: Coil spring replacement.

Jacques1965 · Post by **Jacques1965** » Sat Feb 06, 2016 6:14 pm

check the speedpump on the carburettor. If you take the air cleaner off and accellerate by hand you should see a squirt of fuel in the first stage. Let me know.

Dowe Koos · Post by **Dowe Koos** » Sat Feb 06, 2016 6:29 pm

Ja Thys, toe ek nog 'n kind was het my pa 'n Holden Monaro en twee Kingswoods stasiewa gehad. Ons het in daai karre die wêreld volgery. Dit was die goeie ou dae.
In elke geval, Pieter ek kyk gou iets op en kan moonlik vir jou help met die start probleem. Sal jou laat weet.

Post by **pietpetoors** » Sun Feb 07, 2016 8:31 am

Het toe so met die tyd geleer dat die Chev 'n Holden V8 in het, 308

Koos , hoe betroubaar was daai Holden enjins? Is dit iets wat lank hou?

Dowe Koos · Post by **Dowe Koos** » Sun Feb 07, 2016 10:16 am

Hallo Pieter.
Op die vraag van hoe betroubaar daardie enjin is, in sy tyd was dit van die beste. Ek praat van 1972 het my pa sy Kingswood verkoop en drie jaar terug loop my broer die einste Kingswood raak in Zambië. Selfde persoon wat dit by my pa gekoop het, het dit vir sy seun gee. Die sê toe dat dit nog steeds die oorspronklike enjin in het. Nouja, ons praat van 41 jaar later.
Die enjin wil nie start as dit koud is nie, is of ignition of petrol of kompreesie is die probleem. Wil net vra dat jy maar net seker maak dat die vuur orde in die regte volgorde is, naamlik 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2. As die volgorde reg is maak net seker dat jou vonkprop drade reg is.
Petrol gewys, defektiewe petrol pomp, needle en seat wat vas sit. Verstopte petrol pyp of defektiewe filter kan dit nie wees nie want die motor loop reg as hy aan die gang kom.
Kyk of jou vakuum diagfragma reg is, want dit kan met die start 'n probleem wees as dit lek.
As al hierdie goed reg is, is die volgende stap dan die kompressie. Toets die kompressie en kyk of hulle reg is.
Hoop dit help.

ThysdJ · Post by **ThysdJ** » Mon Feb 08, 2016 7:49 am

Die engines is goed Pieter.

Jy moet kyk na die hydraulic lifters. Hulle begin deurslyt waar die cam lobe hom druk, dan lek die olie deur en dan lift die lifters nie meer nie. Ek het dit op myne gehad, maar dit was daai tyd 'n $16 fix.

Post by **Mud Dog** » Mon Feb 08, 2016 12:22 pm

Family_Dog wrote:T'is true. In my days of youth, we had horse-drawn Roman Chariots. Used to whip 'em for speed.

-F_D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4i6KPyyEXA8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Or this one .....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLCkrqW9Ngs" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **pietpetoors** » Tue Apr 12, 2016 5:02 pm

And so she passed roadworthy today

ThysdJ · Post by **ThysdJ** » Tue Apr 12, 2016 5:35 pm

As jy haar eendag wil verkoop, hou my in gedagte asb.

Post by **pietpetoors** » Tue Apr 12, 2016 6:57 pm

: moticon-thinking.png (6.22 KiB) Viewed 13076 times

Post by **pietpetoors** » Tue Apr 12, 2016 7:20 pm

het jy nog daai 350 checv engine?

Post by **Mud Dog** » Wed Apr 13, 2016 5:40 am

pietpetoors wrote:And so she passed roadworthy today

What are your intentions for the vehicle?

Post by **pietpetoors** » Wed Apr 13, 2016 1:46 pm

My intentions was a total rebuild. But 2 of my dreams always were to own a car with a 350 Chev engine and to own an AC Cobra.

While working on this car I realised that with the same amount of sweat, bit more money and bit more time I can rather build what I always wanted.

I might put her in the market and the money I get for here can pay for half the first phase of the Cobra.

If I can't sell her I will continue fixing and double the price once finished.

Post by **Mud Dog** » Thu Apr 14, 2016 10:01 am

Yup, you should have gone straight for the jugular

- Ac Cobra with Chevvy 350

Funnily enough, some years ago, there was a local guy with just that combo and as far as I know it worked pretty well for him.

ChrisF · Post by **ChrisF** » Thu Apr 14, 2016 8:00 pm

was a place in Montagu Gardens that built AC Cobras and Darts. Either as a road worthy version, but mostly for track day cars .....

Had dreams of owning a Dart .... who knows ....

Post by **pietpetoors** » Thu Apr 28, 2016 6:20 pm

I removed the tappet covers today to have it sand blasted and powder coated.

I see the left bank has sludge build up on the rockets and inside of the tappet cover and the right bank is perfectly clean. Anybody have an idea why this happens? Does the left bank maybe run richer than the right bank?

Post by **Mud Dog** » Thu Apr 28, 2016 9:04 pm

Hi Pieter. Are you talking about black sludge or that brownish colour sludge like you get when water has got into the oil?

The black stuff normally indicates excessive temp .... could be that the water galleries in that head are a bit choked - sometimes also happens if the gasket holes are too small (could be that the motor was worked on and that side gasket replaced with a non OEM part).

Agteros · Post by **Agteros** » Fri Apr 29, 2016 4:49 am

pietpetoors wrote:Last night took steering box out to have seals replaced.

Also took rear coils out to have new ones made. .

coils (2).jpg

coils (1).jpg

Pieter is dit tennisballe wat in daai coils gedruk is?

My pa het so 'n Chev Kommando 4.1 gery waarin hy ook sulke groen tennisballe gedruk het.

Post by **pietpetoors** » Fri Apr 29, 2016 7:01 am

Pieter is dit tennisballe wat in daai coils gedruk is?

Ha Ha, ja dit was, hulle was so oud, was al klipard. Gelukkig het Mikem die coils weer nuwe lewe gegee en die tennisballe is nie meer nodig nie.

Post by **pietpetoors** » Sat May 14, 2016 5:58 pm

I had the air cleaner, tappet covers and rear number plate bracket sand blasted and powder coated.

The air cleaner at some stage, somebody tried to chrome but it was rusted. I went for a matt black powder coating.

Monday is the big day, she will go to the panel beater to be stripped down, rust cut out and repainted.
Apparently this is a three month process.

The other reason for the difficult starting was the fast idle function on the Rochester carb. There is a separate idle speed screw on the left side of the carb where you only set the fast idle function. The fast idle will disengage when the choke opens. When I received the carb back from service that idle screw was screwed out completely and I did not know what the screw did at the time. Since playing with the screw the cold starting improved a lot.

: Chevy air cleaner and tappet cover

Post by **pietpetoors** » Sat May 14, 2016 6:11 pm

I would like to add, maybe it helps somebody else one day:
The Constantia has a Holden 308 engine , not a Chevy engine.
The starting problem was part due to faulty timing.
There is no TDC mark on the crank and I made a TDC mark and set timing to the recommended 6 degrees.
But even then the timing was bad. I then read on an Ausie forum that if you install some electronic ignition dizzies, you must add 10 degrees to your timing. Where the standard for this one is 6 degrees, you should now set it on 16 degrees. ( I bought it with electronic dizzy installed). 16 degrees is way off the scale on the timing cover, thus you have to guess where it is.

So I did what one mechanic in Langebaan suggested. Let it run, turn the distributor in one directly until engine starts to run uneven and not the spot, then turn it to the other direction until engine runs uneven and note the spot. Now turn it back to the middle between the bad spots and leave it there. If it pings, retard it 2 degrees at a time until it don't ping no more and that is where you leave it. So finding the sweet spot takes a bit of setting, driving, setting, driving, not that I mind the driving part.

The other reason for the difficult starting was the fast idle function on the Rochester carb. There is a separate idle speed screw on the left side of the carb where you only set the fast idle function. The fast idle will disengage when the choke opens.

Post by **Family_Dog** » Sat May 14, 2016 7:00 pm

I then read on an Ausie forum that if you install some electronic ignition dizzies, you must add 10 degrees to your timing. Where the standard for this one is 6 degrees, you should now set it on 16 degrees.

This applies to the 4Y engine as well when running EFI with an electronic dizzie. Perhaps not those exact same figures but I do recall Bennie had to reset the timing quite drastically.

-F_D

Post by **pietpetoors** » Wed May 18, 2016 7:25 pm

Hard work begun, but I am not doing it. Lots of rust to be cut out.

: Chev

: Chev

This is what GM's original paint looks like inside the doors after 43 years. Note how clean the metal is, although the paint start to flake now it preserved the metal rather good.

: This is what GM's original paint looks like inside the doors after 43 years

: Chev

Post by **Mud Dog** » Wed May 18, 2016 9:48 pm

What's the old saying .... "they don't make them like they used to" .... well, that may be true. Most vehicle manufacturers put the bodies through some chemical baths for rust inhibition before they got any primer. Judging by the dark colour of the underlying metal I would hazard a guess that phosphoric acid was used, same stuff you find in many etch primers, the active ingredient in 'rust converters' and also used in the process of gun bluing.

Lets face it, it's not bad for 40 years.

Post by **CasKru** » Thu May 19, 2016 6:36 am

Kan nie wag om daai finale produk te sien nie

Post by **pietpetoors** » Thu May 19, 2016 9:05 am

Kan nie wag om daai finale produk te sien nie

Ek okkie, daai ou is 'n kunstenaar, hy raak op 'n plak as hy oor die metaal streel, jy kan sien hy het 'n passie vir wat hy doen en hy vat net een projek op 'n slag aan. Vir drie maande lank is daai nou sy baba en dit is al waarop hy fokus.

Froll · Post by **Froll** » Sun May 22, 2016 11:27 am

Cant wait to see the end result.

Knuppel · Post by **Knuppel** » Tue May 24, 2016 4:02 pm

Ek hou hom mooi dop

, gaan hy weer dieselfde kleur wees Piet?

Post by **pietpetoors** » Wed May 25, 2016 8:25 am

Ek het baie gewik en weeg oor die kleur en besluit om dit nie weer daardie kleur te maak. Hy gaan nou donker rooi word, dink dit gaan mooi lyk saam die wit vinyl.

: Chev Constantia

Knuppel · Post by **Knuppel** » Wed May 25, 2016 1:46 pm

Ek dink dis n baie goeie keuse. Ek sien uit na die eind produk.

The Legend · Post by **The Legend** » Wed May 25, 2016 2:19 pm

METALLIC ROOI

Die nuwe Renault het n mooi een

Post by **pietpetoors** » Wed May 25, 2016 4:11 pm

Wil by redelik standaard kleur bly.
Wou eers 1973 Camaro se rooi vat, maar daai rooie lyk effe oranje in die son. Ek het iets gevat wat effe donkerder as dit is, amper soos foto 1 hieronder

: Rooier; 440px-'72_Chevrolet_Chevelle_SS_(Auto_classique_VAQ_Mont_St-Hilaire_'11).JPG (36.34 KiB) Viewed 12465 times

Die foto gee net idee hoe rooi saam wit dak lyk.

: Rooi

The Legend · Post by **The Legend** » Wed May 25, 2016 5:43 pm

Stem saam met jou Pieter dit gaan baie mooi lyk.Pieter net n vragie ,wys daardie wit viniel top nie baie gou as hy vuil is nie? Is dit nie mission om hom skoon te hou nie?

Post by **pietpetoors** » Thu May 26, 2016 9:05 am

Ek weet nie. Het die kar nou eers 'n paar maande. Dak was nie baie vuil toe ek hom gekry het en by vorige eienaar het hy heeltyd buite gestaan. Het hom met sterk seep water gewas en toe Dubin gesmeer. Ek sien baie ouens reken hulle gebruik sommer wit Cobra vloer politoer om die vinyl in stand te hou.