Gas Installation

Discuss anything here as long as it is clean. Having a hard time with your Skoonma, tell us about it here, or discuss the Rugby. Whatever you feel like talking about.
Post Reply
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

Second week in a row the power goes out while the wife is busy cooking .....


She has now agreed to a 4-plate gas top.


The gas installer says we need a metal cage for the gas cylinders - something about the distance of the cylinders to our property line ... yada yada ....


Hoping one of the members here is in the game and give me some guidance ...



looking at photos I see some cages have locking gates, others just latches .... Can I just make my own cage where the gate just clips into place ?


There are too many open drain points along the wall at the kitchen, so the cage should be fitted around the corner - under an "afdak" - is this a legal option ?




PS - 2 to 3 week waiting list before they can install ....
User avatar
Mud Dog
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 29852
Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2008 2:18 am
Town: East London
Vehicle: '90 SFA Hilux DC 4X4, Full OME, 110mm lift. Brospeed branch, 50mm ss freeflow exhaust. 30 x 9.5 Discoverer S/T's on Viper mags. L/R tank. (AWOL) '98 LTD 2.4 SFA, dual battery system. Dobinson suspension, LR tanks, 31" BF mud's.
Real Name: Andy
Club VHF Licence: HC103

Re: Gas Installation

Post by Mud Dog »

Many years back while I was still doing bulk installation maintenance for Shell / Easigas, there were no guidelines for cage structure, don't know about now. The main criteria then was a "gas enclosure" that kept unauthorised persons out and at a distance that was "safe" IRO naked lights, cell phone usage, smoking etc. Never made much sense to me because LPG is heavier than air and doesn't rise and disperse harmlessly - it flows downhill and safe dispersal depends on the volume of discharge / leakage, distance from the discharge, wind, ambient temp and a few other factors. The reason for then having domestic cages makes no sense other than security and to prevent 'unauthorised' tampering.

If a bottle blows, there's no way that most cages I've seen will contain any projectiles, neither will it diminish the searing effects of the fire ball (600 to 800° C if I remember correctly). Legislation may have changed, but at that time there was no problem in building your own cage for domestic use.

The argument that it's too close to your boundary still makes no sense to me, but you sometimes have your grandchildren visiting and playing in the yard - one never knows what they can get up to when playing outside alone, even the best disciplined kids are curious.

Never mind the regs, for that reason alone I would do it, even if it's just a 9kg bottle (which I understand doesn't require a cage). Build it yourself and make it child-proof and inaccessible to affirmative shopping. ;-)
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

Image
Image

Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
Willem01
LR 4WD Full Lockers
LR 4WD Full Lockers
Posts: 586
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2011 12:13 pm
Town: Pretoria
Vehicle: het nie 1 nie
Real Name: Willem

Re: Gas Installation

Post by Willem01 »

I staying in a rental unit no external installation options allowed , installed it on the 23 March so it sits under the kitchentop in a cupboard with all the rules applicable,,,,been using it every night for cooking still the 1st bottle.
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

Willem01 wrote:I staying in a rental unit no external installation options allowed , installed it on the 23 March so it sits under the kitchentop in a cupboard with all the rules applicable,,,,been using it every night for cooking still the 1st bottle.
Jip up to 9kg may be used inside the house.

and if less than 2m just a flexi-hose.

DIRT CHEAP if you do it this way.


But that means you loose a pretty decent section of your cupboard. And since it does not fit below the shelf you end up removing the shelf, OR you need to get up to some carpentry to make space for the bottle and to keep most of the shelf ..... this is what we did at my BIL's house.

When the installer came they still drilled various vent holes in the cupboard.



The downside with this that if the bottle runs out my wife would have to swop out bottles .... THIS wont go down well. She will gladly use a permanent installation, but she is seriously scared of working with the bottles.




As soon as one goes through a wall, then it has to be a copper pipe installation.




It is the cage part I dont get ......


You need to get past TWO locked gates to get to my back yard - vandalism and theft is not a reasonable concern. And if somebody gets that far into my property then no cage will stop him.

That said, with a 4 year old that visits us 8 days a week :) I fully agree with Andy that it should be tamper proof. For this it is easy to make a front that clips in and gets pad-locked into place, with no hinges ... just not sure if this would comply with the regs .... I could make this for a few hundred bucks, a few hundred more for galvanising - nearly R3k to buy it !!
User avatar
Mud Dog
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 29852
Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2008 2:18 am
Town: East London
Vehicle: '90 SFA Hilux DC 4X4, Full OME, 110mm lift. Brospeed branch, 50mm ss freeflow exhaust. 30 x 9.5 Discoverer S/T's on Viper mags. L/R tank. (AWOL) '98 LTD 2.4 SFA, dual battery system. Dobinson suspension, LR tanks, 31" BF mud's.
Real Name: Andy
Club VHF Licence: HC103

Re: Gas Installation

Post by Mud Dog »

Make it yourself but put it on hinges, just maybe one day the wife will have to swap the regulator over to a full bottle - lifting a gate off every time may be cumbersome.

As for the copper pipe, no problem, just use normal 15mm plumbing fittings and 15mm class 1 copper tubing. Make up all your piping with 'Conex' fittings instead of the sweat-on type and use PTFE on all your compression glands - safe as houses. ;-)

If you want to use the sweat on fittings then you have to pressure test. :eh:
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

Image
Image

Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
User avatar
george
Monster Truck
Monster Truck
Posts: 6565
Joined: Wed May 23, 2007 11:16 am
Town: Velddrif
Vehicle: Triton 3.5l V6
Real Name: George
Club VHF Licence: HC107
Location: Velddrif
Contact:

Re: Gas Installation

Post by george »

ALso the first time I hear of a cage.Maybe they changed it. When I still stayed in Durbanville it had to had a chain around the bottle and had to be more than 1.5meters away from a window.
"The World is a book, and those who do not travel read only a page.-Saint Augustine"
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

Mud Dog wrote:Make it yourself but put it on hinges, just maybe one day the wife will have to swap the regulator over to a full bottle - lifting a gate off every time may be cumbersome.

As for the copper pipe, no problem, just use normal 15mm plumbing fittings and 15mm class 1 copper tubing. Make up all your piping with 'Conex' fittings instead of the sweat-on type and use PTFE on all your compression glands - safe as houses. ;-)

If you want to use the sweat on fittings then you have to pressure test. :eh:
thinking of "bottom hinge pins" - almost like a bakkie tailgate. Flip it up and lock in place. With an extra bit in place the front can then open 90 degrees and create a horizontal platform .....



I will get the local gas guys to do the full install, including the copper tubing. Their install price is very reasonable. Just the cage price I dont like ....
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

george wrote:ALso the first time I hear of a cage.Maybe they changed it. When I still stayed in Durbanville it had to had a chain around the bottle and had to be more than 1.5meters away from a window.
I do know the rules changed in 2013/14 ....

The game is now seriously over regulated. But dealing with gas and your loved ones it is not a bad thing.
User avatar
Aquanaut
LR 4WD Rear Locker
LR 4WD Rear Locker
Posts: 320
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2012 11:37 am
Town: Durban
Vehicle: Hilux 3.0D4D
Real Name: Basil

Re: Gas Installation

Post by Aquanaut »

Did my own. Once done I called in a 'gas' guy, and had him inspect and sign it off. Paid for the inspection and certificate only.
User avatar
KOBUSL
Monster Truck
Monster Truck
Posts: 2044
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:12 pm
Town: WOLSELEY
Vehicle: '96 HILUX 2.8 HILUX DC 3i BMW 540 RANCHERO UTE 4 Li
Real Name: KOBUS

Re: Gas Installation

Post by KOBUSL »

Chris, ek het een van die outjies ingesit. ( Hy prop net in ) ALLE vrouens is bang vir gas, hierdie stel hulle gerus vir gas wat lek.
Inteendeel, hy skreeu as jy enigiets by hom verby spuit, maar jy hoor hom.



GAS15.jpg
(7.7 KiB) Downloaded 305 times
Word te vinnig oud en te stadig wys.
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

Dankie Kobus. Waar het jy dit gekoop ?
User avatar
KOBUSL
Monster Truck
Monster Truck
Posts: 2044
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:12 pm
Town: WOLSELEY
Vehicle: '96 HILUX 2.8 HILUX DC 3i BMW 540 RANCHERO UTE 4 Li
Real Name: KOBUS

Re: Gas Installation

Post by KOBUSL »

ChrisF wrote:Dankie Kobus. Waar het jy dit gekoop ?
Chris, ek dink dit kom van een van die bouhandelaars ( Build It of Mica ), kannie onthou nie. Probeer selfs Makro of Brights.
Word te vinnig oud en te stadig wys.
User avatar
Bushwacker
Monster Truck
Monster Truck
Posts: 2718
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:34 pm
Town: Vryheid Natal
Vehicle: 2003 HILEX, 35" maxxis. 2009 Prado 120 VX
Real Name: Piet

Re: Gas Installation

Post by Bushwacker »

KOBUSL wrote:Chris, ek het een van die outjies ingesit. ( Hy prop net in ) ALLE vrouens is bang vir gas, hierdie stel hulle gerus vir gas wat lek.
Inteendeel, hy skreeu as jy enigiets by hom verby spuit, maar jy hoor hom.



GAS15.jpg
So jy sit hom nie langs 'n toilet nie :lmao:
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

Bushwacker wrote:
KOBUSL wrote:Chris, ek het een van die outjies ingesit. ( Hy prop net in ) ALLE vrouens is bang vir gas, hierdie stel hulle gerus vir gas wat lek.
Inteendeel, hy skreeu as jy enigiets by hom verby spuit, maar jy hoor hom.



GAS15.jpg
So jy sit hom nie langs 'n toilet nie :lmao:
die moderne huise is so klein mens sal die ding moet afsit na n lekker kool bredie ... :siffler:
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

hok is amper klaar. Dan die hekke maak. :)

sal vroeg in die week dit moet ingee vir galvanising ....
User avatar
KOBUSL
Monster Truck
Monster Truck
Posts: 2044
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:12 pm
Town: WOLSELEY
Vehicle: '96 HILUX 2.8 HILUX DC 3i BMW 540 RANCHERO UTE 4 Li
Real Name: KOBUS

Re: Gas Installation

Post by KOBUSL »

Grapgatte.

My vrou was taamlik omgekrap toe hy begin skreeu het oor 'n pot boontjiesop.

Nog voor ons dit ge-eet het. :lol: :lol:
Word te vinnig oud en te stadig wys.
User avatar
Mud Dog
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 29852
Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2008 2:18 am
Town: East London
Vehicle: '90 SFA Hilux DC 4X4, Full OME, 110mm lift. Brospeed branch, 50mm ss freeflow exhaust. 30 x 9.5 Discoverer S/T's on Viper mags. L/R tank. (AWOL) '98 LTD 2.4 SFA, dual battery system. Dobinson suspension, LR tanks, 31" BF mud's.
Real Name: Andy
Club VHF Licence: HC103

Re: Gas Installation

Post by Mud Dog »

Chris, if I understand your idea correctly, a flip-down gate is a hassle when you have to lift a full heavy bottle over it. I would rather go for side-hung gates with padlock lugs. ;-)
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

Image
Image

Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

Mud Dog wrote:Chris, if I understand your idea correctly, a flip-down gate is a hassle when you have to lift a full heavy bottle over it. I would rather go for side-hung gates with padlock lugs. ;-)
die hok mag nie meer as 50mm bo die grond wees nie .... so die voorentoe-flip is uit.

Enkel hek gemaak wat na die kant sal swaai. Skarniere sal gepop-rivet word na die galvanisering.


"stopper-plates" bo en onder (met n stukkie rubber om wind rattles te stop), dan n enkel padlock bracket in die middel van die hek. (dit is al wat ek nog moet sny en sweis) ... oops, moet ook nog plate agter vassweis en boor om dit aan die muur te kan vasbout.


voor die swembad bouery die werf SKOON gemaak ... nou is daai stuk plaat wat al twee jaar rondlê WEG .... sal Maandag n plaat kry vir die boonste vlak. :siffler:


Darem LEKKER om so in die garage te speel terwyl die sagte Kaapse winter reen uitsak ....
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

KLAAR :)


Hok is klaar, hek is klaar, gate geboor vir galvanizing, skarnier gate klaar geboor (so bietjie groter gemaak vir die galv)

ingelaai in die bakkie, nou net aflaai by galvaniseerders :) :)
User avatar
Mud Dog
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 29852
Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2008 2:18 am
Town: East London
Vehicle: '90 SFA Hilux DC 4X4, Full OME, 110mm lift. Brospeed branch, 50mm ss freeflow exhaust. 30 x 9.5 Discoverer S/T's on Viper mags. L/R tank. (AWOL) '98 LTD 2.4 SFA, dual battery system. Dobinson suspension, LR tanks, 31" BF mud's.
Real Name: Andy
Club VHF Licence: HC103

Re: Gas Installation

Post by Mud Dog »

:thumbup: :thumbup:
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

Image
Image

Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

klaar :cooldude:
DSCN2281 (Small).JPG
DSCN2281 (Small).JPG (63.71 KiB) Viewed 3070 times
DSCN2283 (Small).JPG
DSCN2283 (Small).JPG (54.74 KiB) Viewed 3070 times
User avatar
Mud Dog
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 29852
Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2008 2:18 am
Town: East London
Vehicle: '90 SFA Hilux DC 4X4, Full OME, 110mm lift. Brospeed branch, 50mm ss freeflow exhaust. 30 x 9.5 Discoverer S/T's on Viper mags. L/R tank. (AWOL) '98 LTD 2.4 SFA, dual battery system. Dobinson suspension, LR tanks, 31" BF mud's.
Real Name: Andy
Club VHF Licence: HC103

Re: Gas Installation

Post by Mud Dog »

Netjies! :thumbup:

Hoe groot is daai gaps agter op die kante?
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

Image
Image

Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

Andy the gaps should be about 5 to 10 mm, at least that is what I aimed for .... will see when I mount it this weekend. :tease:



This cage would have cost near R3k if I bought it from the gas installers. All in, it cost less than R1,5k to make myself :)
User avatar
Jaws
LR 4WD Full Lockers
LR 4WD Full Lockers
Posts: 536
Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:41 am
Town: Sharonlea
Vehicle: 2009 D4D 4x4
Real Name: Herman

Re: Gas Installation

Post by Jaws »

Chris have you checked SANS for gas installation or do you guys have local regulations down in DA ville ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
:thumbup:
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

Jaws wrote:Chris have you checked SANS for gas installation or do you guys have local regulations down in DA ville ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I only briefly glanced at the code.


Punchline is that I want to get the installation certified, both for insurance and peace of mind.

full installation WITH the certificate - R 1400

If you get them out to certify an existing installation - R 1000


makes no sense to then try and do it myself.


I spoke to the guys and confirmed what they need for our layout.




Should add Brackenfell Gas did the install for my BIL, and also for a friend. Happy with them.


PS - the certificate is issued in terms of the national regs for gas installations.
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

Herman I had a closer look at the regs today.

As with most regs it is confusing when you read it the first time ....


some clear guidelines on the distances to doors, windows, drains, perimeter walls, etc etc ...


I have not been able to find anything in the SANS Code for a cage for a domestic installation - BUT, and this is a big but - at least two items could be interpreted to require a cage :
1) the manifold should be protected against tampering
2) if there are any windows above the gas then a solid plate is put on top of the cage to meet the regs.


personally - with a 4 year old visiting us 6 days a week I would rather play safe and go the cage route.
User avatar
Jaws
LR 4WD Full Lockers
LR 4WD Full Lockers
Posts: 536
Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:41 am
Town: Sharonlea
Vehicle: 2009 D4D 4x4
Real Name: Herman

Re: Gas Installation

Post by Jaws »

Hi Chris that's why I asked could not remember that a cage was required when I read the Sans but I do see it being used everywhere that why I wondered .

Yes the distance from open drains and windows does make the installation a bit more challenging .

I do think that the cage is the best way to do it , also to secure it from being stolen


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
:thumbup:
User avatar
ChrisF
Top Web Wheeler
Top Web Wheeler
Posts: 8188
Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:56 pm
Town: inniedorp
Vehicle: Toy
Real Name: Chris

Re: Gas Installation

Post by ChrisF »

Installation done.


WOW !!!!!!

what a pleasure to see an ARTISAN at work !!

Been a long while since I saw an artisan with such attention to detail.

And his assistant was off sick, thus his gas-geyser install took longer and he started late afternoon. Even as clock off time approached he kept a steady pace and never rushed any step. H finished at about 18:00.


And to top it off, this artisan is probably late 20's or maybe early 30's.
User avatar
Donkey
Monster Truck
Monster Truck
Posts: 5132
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2009 12:33 am
Town: Johannesburg
Vehicle: 2002 3.0KZ-TE 4x4, Eazyawn RTT, Snorkel, NudgeM Bumper, 38mm Ball Joint Spacers, 35" Maxxis Bighorns, Dastek Unichip, 60 ltr Snomaster fridge/freezer, 40mm body lift, Mikem front/rear with extended shackles, Bilsteins shox rear
Real Name: Tumelo Thebe aka Baas John
Club VHF Licence: X122

Re: Gas Installation

Post by Donkey »

Bushwacker wrote:
KOBUSL wrote:Chris, ek het een van die outjies ingesit. ( Hy prop net in ) ALLE vrouens is bang vir gas, hierdie stel hulle gerus vir gas wat lek.
Inteendeel, hy skreeu as jy enigiets by hom verby spuit, maar jy hoor hom.



GAS15.jpg
So jy sit hom nie langs 'n toilet nie :lmao:
:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:
Tumelo Maketekete
Donkey, simple and often misunderstood.
We don't stop playing because we grow old, but we grow old because we stop playing!

2002 - 3.0KZ-TE Toyota Hilux (Letebele)
1994 - 1.6i Gl Toyota Corolla (Platkar)
1990 - Gli TwinCam 16v (ZuluBoy)

ImageImage
Post Reply

Return to “Open Discussion”