Something most people don't want to hear!

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Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:46 pm

G'day folks,

I want to share something with those interested enough in their health to care.

Firstly, let us say some bad happens and you loose everything, house, cars, job - everything! What have you got left?
I'll tell you what! Life! And what does life entail? Love, compassion, and yes, health! But without health, life is real hard! So health is a prime candidate for super investment, won't you say?

OK, on to the real story. Quite a while ago ('bout 7 years) me wifey got real sick. She would just loose consciousness anytime, anywhere. Long story short, we went the whole hog - all sorts of scans and tests. NOTHING!
Doctors here, there, everywhere. A lot of money out of my pocket and none the wiser, we tried all sorts of remedies and boere rate, but still nothing.
Then we came across a video called "Forks over knives". We watched it and followed it up with lots of research resulting in us going totally vegan (I can already hear the meat eaters shouting at me :shh: )
This entailed eating as much raw fruit and veg as possible, no processed- or refined foods and no animal derived products. No cooking of anything, only steamed (not in the microwave) veggies the odd occasion.

we've been going at this now for quite a while and let me tell you, the both of us have got so much energy, we irritate each other. Wifey has not passed out since about two months after we went vegan. Her [extremely] poor blood circulation also miraculously improved - to the point that she doesn't even get the tingling sensations in her toes and fingers anymore and neither does she have cold hands and feet.
Both of us are experiencing better eye sight - to the point where we have had to go for new glasses (and the optometrist confirmed the improvement). There are so many improvements that I can't name them all, But just a few follows;
no more bloated feeling
much better sleeping patterns
no more stinking breaths
no more constipation - far better bowel movements
No more gout or arthritis
clarity of thought
improved concentration

and many more.

This is really worth making a lifestyle. Please note, we are not following a diet, but an adjusted lifestyle. And I think it is the best investment I have ever made.
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Mon Nov 05, 2012 5:08 pm

i've heard this from a number of people
cut out red meat ,poultry too
guys only on fish
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Mon Nov 05, 2012 5:09 pm

Interesting. Just as a matter of interest... what are your blood types?
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Mon Nov 05, 2012 6:37 pm

uhm ja ..... well ....


Know a couple, the lady has MS. They have gone vegan a few years back. Seems to help HER.

BUT, nothing is THAT easy !!!!!!!!!


This is NOT a balances diet and does come at a price !!


and PLEASE, do not spread "half truths" - it can NOT cure all types of arthritis !! this is a most dangerous, and totally incorrect statement !! YES, many types of arthitis are linked to imbalances in the system, and it may be possible to remedy these if the balance is restored. BUT, many other types of arthritis, and some DESTRUCTIVE types of arthitis can only be managed/slowed with the proper use of medication - playing "games" with these types WILL lead to joint replecements !! creating false hope, and possibly destroying peoples lives is most irrisponsible.


I AM sorry if this comes over "hard", but lets go have coffee with Michelle - a wheel chair bound teenager facing multiple joint replacements, IF she had the correct treatment early on she would still be living a relatively normal live. arthritis is NOT to be toyed with !!! Once you have met Michelle you will know where this reply comes from



PS - I AM happy that this diet/live style is working for you

PPS - Would be most interesting what science "discovers" in 10 years about the hormone filled processed food we eat today .....
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Mon Nov 05, 2012 8:17 pm

My motto in life - "health before wealth", that said I try and eat good food, and enjoy my beers (sometimes more than I should - but oh isn't mother's milk just... tastes like an angel pee'd on my tongue :mocking: :lmao: )

But cut a long story short, nothing beats good exercise also. Luckily I have not been sick yet, never been in hospital for anything and am now 36, but the minute I stop with exercise almost everything goes: low lobido, lack of appetite, battle to sleep, no bowel movement and so on.

Thank you for the advise! :thumbup:
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Mon Nov 05, 2012 8:28 pm

Hi Donkey

"But cut a long story short, nothing beats good exercise also. Luckily I have not been sick yet, never been in hospital for anything and am now 36, but the minute I stop with exercise almost everything goes: low lobido, lack of appetite, battle to sleep, no bowel movement and so on." :surrender:

What you are saying is that to keep your bowels & libido moving, :yahoo: you also need to keep moving/excersizing :blushing:
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Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:13 pm

As ek my skaap tjoppies opoffer gaan ek beter kan sien? :naah:

Dan voel ek maar waar is die braaier!!! :lol:
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Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:55 pm

Seems like you were right Paul
Something most people don't want to hear!
I agree with you, it is very hard to do but for the once or twice we manage to cut out meat for a week or two I feel great. But eish, it is hard to brake that habit. I think lik emany things only once you are forced to make a drastic change do you make it.
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Tue Nov 06, 2012 6:27 am

According to studies I've read etc it is unfortunately not that clear cut. It depends on your heritage and your blood type as well. For instance a person with blood type O+ can process meats better than other blood types.
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Tue Nov 06, 2012 6:47 am

CasKru wrote:According to studies I've read etc it is unfortunately not that clear cut. It depends on your heritage and your blood type as well. For instance a person with blood type O+ can process meats better than other blood types.
And what about blood type ORH+ :?: :?:

I must take my hat off to you people that go the vegan route... :welcome:

I love my meat to much to even think about it..... :thumbup:
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Tue Nov 06, 2012 3:19 pm

:lol: told ye so!!!!

Well guys, I have shared our experiences. Please note, I am not trying to convince anybody of anything - different strokes for different blokes! Your choices are yours alone - as will be the consequences. If anybody can benefit from what I have shared - great!

@ Caskru, yeah, we've studied the Peter D'adamo's blood type diet too (been there, done that...), but believe me it didn't work for us, and I personally know many people who followed that diet to the letter without any sign of success and even to the contrary, got sicker. Wifey is type "O" (the big so-called meat eaters) and I am "AB" type with a stomach like a iron pot (used to be as both as hard AND as big :o: , but now it is only as hard - meaning I can eat anything and it won't upset me stomach).

@ ChrisF, well, what shall I say. You believe what you believe and your beliefs are based upon the material you have reviewed. I have been part of the academic world for too long to get drawn into debates like these. If you believe certain information to be "half truths", then so be it. What I will say, though, is that unbiased, peer reviewed, world class doctors and their research will not agree with you. :wink2:

@ Thabo, mate, if you have to have that tjoppie, then enjoy it - seeing or blind! :D:

@ Piet, most folks battle with this concept. I thought I was gonna suffer too (and I did a little at first), but once I changed my mindset, it became so much easier. And let me tell you a little secret - the longer you keep it up and the better you feel, the less cravings you get for anything. And it is not only I who will tell you this.

Folks, I reiterate, I am trying to convince anybody of anything. As I've said previously, one's beliefs can ONLY be based upon experience and reviewed material. Now, if you haven't personally experienced something, yet you have an opinion (belief), it means you have read about is somewhere and you believe that which you have read to be the only truth.

Now, let me tell you something about the academic world, which includes the field of medical sciences - or let me rather rephrase that - ESPECIALLY the medical sciences. On any given subject there will always be at least two diametric opposing schools of thought - and each group will be able to present evidence in support of their view. In this case, two of the major opposition views are (a) that no diet is balanced if it consists only of plant material and (b) that a plant only based diet is completely balanced if approached correctly. Both of these groups can present very persuasive arguments to support their respective cases. So which one do we believe? Well, my personal choice (coming from experience) is to go with a view that can present case after case after case of real-time evidence. By that I mean, I would believe a heart surgeon with more than 40 years experience in the field anytime above a heart surgeon with 40 years experience only in a closed environment.
Majority of the medical research is carried out in controlled environment. In other words, quantities and qualities are very precisely controlled in order to get results in support of a hypothesis. But real-time records in an uncontrolled environment supports facts - not hypotheses!

And it such UNBIASED, uncontrolled, peer reviewed research, published in peer reviewed medical journals, that are today busy laying the myths of "a balanced diet must includes animal proteins" to rest. That myth was born from the fact that vegetarians at one stage became sick due to a lack of specifically vitamin B12, which most "experts" claimed can only be found in meat. Well, today these very "experts" have been proven wrong, as the vitamin B12 that is found in meat comes from plants. Vitamin B12 is actually bacteria found in (uncontaminated) soil. This explained why vegans and vegetarians became sick - because most store-bought veggies and fruit has been exposed to so many chemicals that almost no organism can stay alive on it. But when these very same vegans/vegetarians started either planting their own food or buying organic foods, and when they adjusted their diet to consume more of the plants that do contain B12, their "illnesses" disappeared.

Some doctors, however, would fight this with all they have as it would seriously decrease their income if the world all of a sudden becomes healthy. If you really want to know the truth, follow the money trail!

There is so much more to be said, but I think this post is already too long.

Cheers for now, and enjoy whatever it is you are eating!

I leave you with this very true quote on a picture...
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Tue Nov 06, 2012 5:31 pm

But when these very same vegans/vegetarians started either planting their own food
This is a very important point. The veggies you get in the shops are generally crap. I think most of us forgot what a carrot, potato or beans are supposed to taste like if it is fresh from a real garden.

In a small town like Langebaan you battle to get anything that is not "verlep" and if you get it, it is the normal old mass production veggies with almost no taste.

Would be healthier to eat provitas and swallow a handful of vitamins each day

Back to the meat, I cannot imagine dropping the meat, but what I have realised is that you can cook and use a quarter of the meat you normally do and you will still satisfy your desire.
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Tue Nov 06, 2012 6:06 pm

Paul can you please elaborate on the differences between "vegan" and "vegetarian" (the friend who has MS said there is a differencce ... but darend if I could get the hang of it ...)

As a person diagnosed with arthritis I have done the reading .... done the "home research" ..... I am most fortunate to have a rhumatologist that also has a research practise. In fact, have lived with this for the last 15 years. I have even been the subject in one of her trials, for almost a year. Please take my word for it that you get arthritis and arthritis, NOT all types are the same, and not all types respond to the same treatment. Gout is often treated with a lesser liquid diet .... Others can be treated with a dietary change. and then for various others "something more" is needed ....


but let's face it, the EXPERTS dont agree on this topic, so not much chance we will agree ... :)

my personal experiences has shaped my believes, and so has yours .... ONE cup of coffee with Michelle and you will understand my views. SO SAD to see a teenager's life wrecked as she did not have access to the correct meds ....
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Tue Nov 06, 2012 8:01 pm

Paul I can also add, a good friend stopped smoking and picked up "some weight" ...

a year later he got a new lady friend, who is a vegetarian. He started following the life style. Should add they do a lot of walking as well. MAN he lost weight !!!
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Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:09 am

@ Piet, I too live in a very small community where store-bought products only come from commercialized agriculture. In the beginning it was all we could get our hands on, but after we planted our own stuff, man, all I can say is it is like the difference between cheap halfie-halfie petrol bought in Zim and super high octane racing fuel - we could feel and notice the difference within a week.

@ Chris, a vegan is somebody who ONLY eat plants, in other words, NO animal derived products like milk, eggs, cheese, yoghurt, etc. Vegetarians generally don't eat meat, but still eat animals' products like their milk, eggs, cheese, etc. But one must also realize that even within these categories there are sub categories, e.g. within vegan you get Raw, semi-raw, etc.

I am sorry to hear about your condition and experience with it so far. I have great sympathy with you as I have been diagnosed with rheumatoid arthritis at age 7 (or maybe 8) and really suffered from it the last 23 years (minus the last 3 years). I've been to all sorts of quaks, doctors, homeopaths, etc. all over the country, but nothing helped. It got so bad at one stage that I would scream in agony from any movement. I started believing there was nothing to be done, but after I watched that Forks over Knives documentary I made a choice to really, and I mean REALLY go for it - all out vegan and mostly raw. You know what, within 3 months I started noticing a difference, after 6 months I moved much easier, after 9 I hardly had any symptoms left and after 2 years even the surface signs (knobbies, etc) are totally gone. For the first time in my life I can run, jump, and do anything I want without pain and without meds. So my midlife crisis is being a teenager!!! :D:

Chris, I trust you when you share your (very painful) experience with us. All I'm saying is, until you have depleted ALL options, you cannot truly say that your condition is not curable. It was Thomas Edison who said "I have never failed once. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work." - and this is very true.
He also said something else of great truth; "The doctor of the future will give no medicine, but will instruct his patient in the care of the human frame, in diet and in the cause and prevention of disease." And today we have doctors and we have doctors. Some only go with their training and money, and others are really their to heal.
But let me ask you, and you don't have to answer me (or you can PM me); have you ever tried the all out plant based lifestyle? And if so, did you alkaline or acidic?
Maybe you know this, maybe you don't. The human body pH 7.365. Some foods are more acidic and some are more alkaline. The ideal is to to try and keep the pH level either neutral or rather more alkaline than acidic. Meats in general are 3 (very acidic) and cooked foods turn more acidic when cooked. The more acidic one's body is, the more susceptible it is to dis-ease. Furthermore, it takes 20 parts alkalinity to neutralize just one part acidity in the human body.
Something else to consider if fluoride. Yes THAT fluoride you find in municipal drinking water and toothpaste. Current evidence strongly indicates that some people diagnosed with “arthritis” are in fact suffering from low-grade fluoride poisoning.
There are too many variables and possibilities to mention here, believe me.

As for the weight loss, weight stabilization is one of the definite results of such a lifestyle. Overweight will loose and underweight will pick up. I lost 10cm around the middle in the first 2 months and I did NO exorcizes whatsoever - it was still too painful. Within 9 months I was back to 90kg - my normal weight. I have lost 30 kg without any exercise in just 9 months!
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Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:29 am

Something I just want to mention for interest' sake. 90% of meat eaters are actually after the taste of the condiments used in preparing and cooking/braaiing the meat. The other 10% are after the taste originating from the blood. The real interesting part is that research in an uncontrolled environment indicates that the less this 10% eats meat, the less they crave meat, but the more they eat meat, the more they crave meat. Of the 90%, 90% again reckon they don't like they taste of meat and they use condiments to hide the fact that they are actually eating a corpse!
I can't now so quickly recall where I read that article (it was in a medical journal), but I do remember how repulsed I was by the idea of eating a "corpse". It instigated a further study of the topic and I came to realize that the moment a living being (human or animal) dies, the flesh already starts decaying - hence the term "ripen the meat". So what we are consuming is actually the purified flesh of a corpse. Now, I've been a hunter all my life. I can't even begin to recall how many animals/fish/birds I've killed and prepared myself. But when this picture nestled firmly in my mind, that I'm devouring rotting flesh, and that it continues to rot inside my body, I just gave it all up.

Another interesting point surfaced a little later while later when I analyzed the human anatomy. Human teeth, jaw movement, muscle compaction and -motion, nail formation and functionality, stomach acid and bowel construction all suggest herbivore. Our stomach contents, for example, are not made to digest flesh or bovine milk. So in order to digest it, our bodies extract calcium, magnesium and other minerals from our own bones - leaving us weaker. The human intestine compared to that of carnivores are much longer and not at all smooth like the carnivores'. This means that the meat goes through the carnivores system quicker while the necessary enzymes, minerals and vitamins are extracted en then it is excreted again before it has to to really rot in the body. But in the human body, because the intestine is so much longer and not as smooth, the meat stays inside longer and has more time to actually decay and rot inside our bodies - hence the rotting smell on meat eaters' breaths. This too, is too big a topic for a single post here.

Oh, and Chris, I agree with you, there will always be grounds for disagreement - on any given topic! :thumbup:
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Wed Nov 07, 2012 10:11 am

Very very interesting, Paul. Your last post sums it up. We are not built for meat, the dikderm is too long. The rotting meat ,I believe, is poisonous. More to some than to others. And it is in your body for a long time, and all the time poisonig it. I am the king of gout, from the age of about 12. I am now 61. For me, its all in the lifestyle, ( or as some will call it, diet ) Everybody with the problem will know what is bad for them. For some people it is beer : I stopped drinking 14 years ago, beer made me nothing. Rum and coke, brandy and coke, no problems. But coke on its own, big problems. m50w

Going vegan sounds right. Milk has the same rotting properties as meat, not good for the joints. As Chris said, you will do anything to ease the pain. On the vegan move : once you started it, you must stick to it. It is like loosing weight : if you are overweight ( fat ) you must and get rid of the fat, get teh body to burn it. How ? First get the liver to start using the fat for energy, so refined foods and sugar is out. You can get the liver working in about three to four weeks time by cutting out all sugars. But if you eat as much as one ( skelm ) cookie, you'll stop the process and must start from scratch. This is the reason people on diets loose confidence. And with the change in lifestyle excercise will help. A brisk walk of about half an hour a day will do the trick.

Sorry about the poor use of the English lingo, but I'm a boertjie, and this post opened my eyes a bit. But as I stated : people are different and react different to the same treatments. And believe me, Faith has a lot to do if you want to get cured.
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Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:12 pm

Great to hear from you, Kobus, and great info you have shared. As I've said, this is a HUGE topic consisting of lots of various points.
Like your point on the liver - SOOooooo true! The liver is the body's dustbin, and if it doesn't function right, the whole body feels it. As a point of interest for gout- and arthritis sufferers, cayenne pepper and turmeric! Two miracle spices!
Cayenne pepper is very alkaline and VERY good for both gout-related and any cardiac/vein-related ailments. This was the first natural remedy I experimented many years ago for both high cholesterol and rheumatoid arthritis. Unfortunately at the time I still continued to eat meat, so the fight was a continuous back-and-forth struggle. But the pepper did wonders for my stomach ulcers and the arthritis. Then the turmeric is a wonderful thing to clean out that old dustbin (liver) and many other ailments. I have been taking a teaspoon of decent quality cayenne pepper in one whole lemon's juice every morning for many years now, and I feel wonderful. Serious conditions can repeat three times daily. The turmeric is a teaspoon full before 10:00am. It gives wooma as well, so don't drink it too late if you battle to sleep.

Kobus, for me personally there are more to the whole thing than just health, but I have learned to keep the rest off public platforms. It is a combination of many "facts and figures" that prompted me to go vegan and as Raw as possible. I cannot see myself ever eating animal products again. It really has become a lifestyle for me.

Never apologize for not being able to speak or write another language 100% (and really, you are doing good in it) for all have something in which they do not excel.

PS> One very important factor which I keep on forgetting to mention is hydration. Man, that is probably THE biggest source of ailments today as approximately 87% of people are dehydrated. There is no answer set in stone as there are too many variables to each unique individual, e.g. your activity, age, weight, weather, alcohol intake, altitude, etc., but you can use websites like this http://nutrition.about.com/library/blwa ... ulator.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; to get you going. We often get headaches and all sorts of pains due to dehydration and we don't even know it!
For the blokes really concerned with health, a decent filter on your tap makes a world of wonders to keep the heavy metals out of your drinking water. Heavy metals is another contributor to many ailments today and the municipalities just don't give a hoot. At one stage I had my drinking water sent to a lab and analyzed. Boy, was I shocked. That is when I got a filter and I've never looked back.
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Wed Nov 07, 2012 2:39 pm

Hoppy wrote:
Vegetarians.jpg


:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:54 pm

Thanks Paul. We are very lucky, our water is fresh out of the mountains, it is even a shame to mix it with whisky. lol
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Wed Nov 07, 2012 5:04 pm

Allan ek voel nou soos daai brak. :)


Maar gaan vanaand n lekker steak eet om my vrou se verjaarsdag te vier.


Paul strange how people differ, for whetever made us this way. I grew up on a farm, on a couple of occasion I had to put down problem animals - such a polite way to say it .... Yet, I NEVER had the stomach for hunting .... BUT heaven forbid Isay anything against hunters, as I enjoy the biltong and braai just too much.


Some people would look at a broiler house and go "off the deep end" about how the chickens are reared in an artificial climate, etc etc. Fact is, if we did not farm this way there would be huge hunger in the world. As long as the animals never suffer I am fine with it, even though it DOES take a bit of getting used to it once you have had these 5 day old chicks climb over your feet ....... Now taking a live animal, cutting its through and standing buy while the live drains out of it - to ME that is CRUEL ! Bullet through the brain, no pain, thats how I prefer it.



PS - no I have tried Vegetarian, never mind Vegan (thanks for explaining the difference). BUT, the last 14 months I HAVE been increasing my intake of salads - still less than most, but a lot more than what it was .... might be hope yet. :)
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Mon Nov 12, 2012 12:19 pm

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Mon Nov 12, 2012 12:53 pm

Hennie you're resting your case to catch your breadth? Is that your form of exercise picking up cases? :mocking:
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Mon Nov 12, 2012 1:30 pm

HENNIE !!!

thanks for wrapping this up .....


hehehehehe ....
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Mon Nov 12, 2012 6:08 pm

From one Hennie to another: "I agree, I have nothing further."
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Tue Nov 13, 2012 9:28 am

Donkey wrote:Hennie you're resting your case to catch your breadth? Is that your form of exercise picking up cases? :mocking:

:thumbup: :thumbup: YEAH! Case of Tafels it was, mate! :lol:

and BTW: it's because of my BREADTH that I need to rest and catch my BREATH!!! :twisted:
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Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:26 pm

hahaha, you guys are too funny, but unfortunately also very ignorant. I've heard all the arguments and seen all the pictures 100's of times before. For every one that you post, I can post a polar opposite. Unfortunately for you, unlike most people I don't blindly believe anything you post. I don't just look at one picture or read one article and believe what is in front of me. I conduct holistic exegesis and then follow the available data. I've learned that the make up artists behind cameras and plastic surgery can let a 100 year old look like a 40 year old and viceversa, like such;
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I've also learned that nothing on this planet will change a meat eater & alcohol consumer's mind if he doesn't want it to be changed (I've been one, remember). That is why I'm not trying to convince anybody or making a debate out of this. But if you want a debate, lets turn up the heat a bit, what not?

So, just for amusement's sake, let us take another look at this. Hereunder is a photo of Dr. Esselstyn (without makeup, unlike Nigella). He was born on 12 December 1933 and lives a total vegan lifestyle. He still jogs every single morning or go cycling.
dr-caldwell-esselstyn.jpg
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Then there is a photo of one Dr. McDougall, born in 1947 and living the same lifestyle.
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Next is 70 year old Anette Larkins;
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Much more where these came from. How about an 80 year old lady that still competes in gymnastics, or a 100 year old man that still finishes marathons in times better than most young men, or a Mr. universe body builder?

Do you want me to go on? When you place photos like that, at least try to look up the the history behind it and post that as well. Nigella has had many botox treatments and plastic surgery over the years. If you've done your homework, you would have known that. Then, please take careful note that this Gillian McKeith is NOT A VEGAN. She experienced a lot of health problems which originated from when she was a child and lived on a very unhealthy diet. This is why she became interested in diets so she could heal herself.

Then there was a remark somewhere (can't seem to find it now) of how there won't be enough food if we, the human race, were to stop killing animals for food. This too, reeks of misinformation. Have you done your homework properly, you would known the figures and ratios if this were to happen. More people would have more food at cheaper prices. The research has been done - internationally! Raising animals for food (including land used for grazing and land used to grow feed crops) currently uses 30 percent of the Earth's land mass. According to scientists at the Smithsonian Institution, the equivalent of seven football fields of land is bulldozed worldwide every minute to create more room for farmed animals. Raising animals for food is grossly inefficient, because while animals eat large quantities of grain, soybeans, oats, and corn, they only produce comparatively small amounts of meat, dairy products, or eggs in return. More than 70% of grain and cereals grown are fed to farmed animals. It takes about 6 kilograms of grain to produce not even 500g of meat. It takes more than 11 times as much fossil fuel to make one calorie from animal protein as it does to make one calorie from plant protein. And many, many more facts. Just shout if you want more.

People, I see this in a good light, but please don't go off half-cocked! I have shared my experience in good faith. Please don't try and make something of it that I never intended. If my posts offend you, please turn away and leave your snotty and uninformed remarks elsewhere. You really don't have to read it.

I leave you with this picture then;
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Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:54 pm

very tempted to say: "You sound very stressed. A good steak will help you to relax."

but I dont know you well enough. not sure we share the same sense of humour ..... so I wont say it.


As your title says: "most people dont want to hear this"

PERSONALLY I do NOT agree with this approach, just like I dont agree with any other "fanatical" approach. For me the answer is in MODERATION.


soos die ou mense gesê het, as daar n "te" bykom is dit nie meer goed nie ....




would also like to add that I am conviced a LOT (most) of our health issues are related to the high stress lives we lead .... too much food, and too little excercise is just the fuel on the fire ...
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Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:51 pm

If vegans were so fond of animals, why do they eat all their food?

It is all what your body can take! My wife was on high protein dieet! Meat, biltong and eggs. Lost 2/3 of her body weight over 6 months. I tried it for 4 weeks - ended up in hospital with acute gout!

I have since reduced my red meat intake by 80% and replaced it with chicken!
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Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:57 pm

ChrisF wrote:very tempted to say: "You sound very stressed. A good steak will help you to relax."

but I dont know you well enough. not sure we share the same sense of humour ..... so I wont say it.


As your title says: "most people dont want to hear this"

PERSONALLY I do NOT agree with this approach, just like I dont agree with any other "fanatical" approach. For me the answer is in MODERATION.


soos die ou mense gesê het, as daar n "te" bykom is dit nie meer goed nie ....





would also like to add that I am conviced a LOT (most) of our health issues are related to the high stress lives we lead .... too much food, and too little excercise is just the fuel on the fire ...
Daar stem ek saam... moderation is the key.
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Wed Nov 14, 2012 6:29 pm

Ek eet baie vleis en ek eet al die vet, en ek vat bietjie wyn, het nou net my "Movember" toetse terug gekry, suiker, cholestrol, bloeddruk ens, ens alles reg.
My vrou eet min vleis en baie groente en bok kos, sy sny al die vet af(vir my), sy vat nie wyn nie en eet nie soetgoed nie, sy is n diabeet, sy het hoe bloeddruk, ens ens.
My suster het 6 jaar gelede n vegetarier geword(uit eie wil), sy het al hoe slegter begin lyk en voel, n paar jaasr later draai sy by die dood om, sy moes dadelik terug op haar ou dieet gaan, sy is nou 2 jaar later weer n gesonde vleis eter.
Ek dink elkeen is anders en jou ligaam sal jou laat weet as jy verkeerd eet en alles met n 'te" vooraan is verkeerd, behalwe tevrede en te perd.
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Wed Nov 14, 2012 6:37 pm

Allan jy herinner my aan my oupa.

Oupa Stollie het elke dag vleis ge-eet. Die uitgebraaide vet is net so op sy brood gesit. Elke dag 3 of 4 kapok eiers ge-eet.

Mens sy dieet het uit als bestaan wat vandag "verkeerd" is !!


MAAR, hy het elke oggend n paar uur GESWEET in sy tuin. Weet nie of jy Swellendam se groot groente tuine ken nie.


En hy in bykans 80 jaar het hy nie eens n verkoue gehad nie, GEEN mediese probleme nie. eers toe is hulle ouetehuis toe, daar het hy nog n hele paar jaar gesond geleef tot sy afsterwe.



dieet - skynbaar verkeerd

leefstyl - GOED, en min stres

gesondheid - PUIK !!


sal ek sy dieet vir iemand aanbeveel - NEE ! maar dit is tog goed om te sien dat die BALANS tussen sy eet en leef styl vir hom gewerk het.
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Wed Nov 14, 2012 6:51 pm

As kind het ons altyd by my een oom op die plaas gekuier, hy het elke oggend 4hoo opgestaan met koffie en beskuit, dan is hy veld toe, so 8hoo se kant is hy terug dan maak my tannie n diep pan half vol vark vet en alles word daarin gaar gemaak, eiers, bacon, wors, choppies ens. dan as hy klaar ge-eet het gooi die tannie n koffie beker vol van daai vark-vet uit die pan uit en dan sluk hy dit af, hy het ook ver oor die tagtig geword?
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Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:28 pm

Let me start by saying I am a BIG meat eater. I grew up on red meat (dad was a Suid Wester who believed chicken was was a veg and pork a fruit :blink: ) and to this day I LOVE it! My dad's parents ate 3 HUGE meals a day and all 3 included red meat. Nobody batted an eyelid when you ate a steak, some boerewors and 4 or 5 skaap tjoppies for dinner. Granddad passed away at age 83 and still a healthy man. Grandma is now 85 and still follows the same diet. She was a thin, beautiful woman until she reached her 50's. Now she's morbidly obese, wheelchair bound (osteo arthritis), has had breast cancer twice in the last 20 years and has almost no quality of life left.

Since I got married to ze German, my red meat intake has drastically reduced. I have gone from eating red meat 6 times a week to once or twice. We eat fish once and the rest of the time chicken. And I have to say that I seriously start craving my protein fix by the time Thursday comes round! I exercise regularly (3-5 hours a week).

Now to get to the point! My red meat diet had no effect on me when I was younger but as I approach my mid thirties I'm starting to find it more and more difficult to control my weight - even with regular and quite intense exercise. We have over the last year or so made some changes to our diet and I'm now slowly returning to my target weight (105kg - just 3kg more to go!). I've lost 17kg in the last year with the same amount of exercise, but small changes to my diet. We eat much more salad and I take more supplements. We eat the same amount of fish, chicken and red meat, but try to not eat starch after lunch.

I find Paul's take on things refreshing, as he is the first Vegan/Vegetarian I've ever heard that does not come with that "murdering of animals" nonsense. Paul, I have a question if you are inclined to answer it. I understand the difference between Vegan and Vegetarian, but what are these other subcategories? And after a week of chicken, fish and intense exercise I "need" my protein fix! Why do I feel so much better (not as tired) after my Friday night braai?

I have no scientific backing for my situation or even ever read anything before about Vegans, etc. I however find your approach enlightening (mainly because you back it with facts and not emotions) and ask these questions to stimulate the debate and to learn more myself.

Thanks for an interesting topic!
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Thu Nov 15, 2012 9:54 am

hahaha, you guys are too funny, but unfortunately also very ignorant.
please turn away and leave your snotty and uninformed remarks elsewhere. You really don't have to read it.
:surrender: :surrender: :surrender: :surrender: :surrender: :surrender: :surrender: :surrender: :surrender:

SJEESH!!!!!

I think you lost your sense of humour somewhere!

Take a chill pill (or a steak or a brandy)

OK I won't read your fanatical drivel anymore! :banned: :banned:
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Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:16 am

No Chris, I don't get stressed out - and you can say what ever pleases you, it affects me not :lol: However, a steak really won't help me relax - in fact, as big a meat eater as I was (three big meals a day all containing meat, very similar to many of your oupas' diets), today I get nauseous from even just the smell. Anyway, there are much better and healthier ways to relax if I do experience stress. :shh: Another's meat consumption really isn't my problem, so it does stress me out if they do eat meat. As I've said before, I shared this for the sake of those who might be able to take something from it and apply it positively to their lives. If you do not agree, that is your prerogative :thumbup: and I've got no hassle with that.

But, I do have a little rebellious hair right on the crown of my head which tends to jump up when people shoot their mouths off without making sure of their facts. Why? Because it always causes harm!

Guys, I agree with all of you who has even the slightest notion that each individual is different. Each body is unique and therefore responds differently to different matters. For example, some people might have the ability to consume meat in large quantities today, every day of their lives and still appear healthy. However, the questions begs to be asked; what happens in that body 20 or 50 or 70 or 80 years later?
A curious phenomenon that has occurred time and again in the past, still occurs presently aplenty, and probably always will occur in the future, is the matter of KNOWING vs THINKING one knows. Let me elaborate;
People make decisions daily to go vegan/vegetarian. Percentage wise, about 60% of these people have either not enough information or a lot of disinformation, which is why they gradually become ill and eventually have to go back to old diets. Going vegan/vegetarian needs to be an informed decision.
One doesn't simply jump off a skyscraper with a pumpkin (parachute) and hope to live through the experience. One doesn't simply jump out of an airplane without any knowledge and hope to survive. NO! You get information and training and slowly build up your experience. If you don't, there will always be a 50/50 chance of going either way - land safely (sort of) or a very hazardous experience to say the least.
Same goes for going vegan or vegetarian. You need to get to know what foods are healthy and especially healthy for YOU. As I've said before, just jumping in and eating won't get you anywhere. Get to know which foods consist of what and how much YOUR very unique body needs daily to fulfill its function. Determine your pH level and aim to get it as close to 7.365 as possible, but preferably a little bit more on the alkaline side. Mostly commercially produced fresh produce are so full of poisons and toxins that they do more harm than good. The human body needs certain microbial fauna and flora that is killed off by these pesticides and herbicides and the washes to keep it appearing fresher for longer.
Another thing to watch out for is genetically modified products which are full of toxins and hormones detrimental to the human body.

Johan Havenga, I've totally lost you on this; "If vegans were so fond of animals, why do they eat all their food?"

Chris, Allan, I think we can all say with fairness that we've had these fantastic old people in our lives and we can all attest to what we've seen. They ate well, but the products they consumed were not contaminated by our modern day toxins and hormones and modifications and unnatural substances. Their stress levels were (mostly) not even a tenth of the average person's stress levels today and their normal daily activities included more stringent exercise than most people today would get in a year. So, by all means, let us compare ourselves to them, but let us also include ALL of the variables. ;-)

Johann, I will try and answer your questions to the best of my abilities.
Within the vegan category, there are sub categories like Raw (only consuming raw fresh produce), semi-raw (mostly raw with some steamed or cooked) and then there are those who mostly cook and eat only some stuff raw. Vegetarian will also have a similar look, with the difference that they might add animals' products to their diets, like eggs, milk, cheese. Not all have the ability to go raw - it really is a hard road to travel (but oh, so worth it to those who can), so they go semi-raw, like my wife, or even mostly cooked with some raw. That is the beauty of going vegan - nothing is set in stone. Oh, for sure there are the hardcore extremists which will try and convince you that anything else is bad and this and that. But then again, we find such extremists among all walks of life, so don't you pay them any attention.

It is a fact that our bodies need protein, which is essentially the building blocks of our bodies, but it can serve as fuel as well. Each individual's daily needs will differ, so you need to start listening to your body (your body remains your best doctor/advisor if you know how to listen to it and not suppress it with all sorts of medicines, pain killers, etc.). You will probably find that your current diet doesn't include sufficient protein, which could be why you need your "protein fix" so badly and then suddenly feel better after having had some meat. Something very important to take note of at this point is the fact that most animal products consumed today are not natural - these animals are raised with a profit margin in mind and time is money, thus plenty hormones and unnatural substances enter their food chain, which enters the human body via consumption (fish meal etc, being fed to chickens, ground up cows parts being fed to cows, and a whole lot more).
If you want, you can start experimenting with natural, organically produced and unwashed fresh produce that are also high in protein, such as large (mature) green beans (fresh or very lightly steamed). Remember, the cooking process destroys the enzymes in food - in fact, most nutrients are destroyed when foods are prepared above 37 degrees C. Other sources of natural protein include legumes, seeds, nuts and fruit, roasted pumpkin-, squash- and watermelon seeds, certain yeasts and yeast extracts, lentils, pulses, wheat gluten and many more.
This is where you need to start doing some homework and you must take into consideration that your body has grown accustomed to your diet over many years, so suddenly changing something might make you feel weak or even sick for a short period until your body has adjusted. I remember I felt sick for about three weeks when I went vegan, but then, I never did it gradually. One day I was eating meat and then I cut off and went totally raw vegan - period!

I hope this has been at least of some help, Johann. There really are so many facets eating and living healthy that it is quite impossible to even try and cover it all here in one go. A big secret lies in properly informing yourself from reliable sources (those who have both experience and unbiased research to back their claims) and not believing everything everybody says PLUS! Our parents used to tell us not to play with our food, but boy were they wrong! :celebrate:
That is the other part of this secret, you HAVE to play with your food! You HAVE to experiment and see how your body reacts to certain foods and certain combinations of food, while not killing the body's messages with suppressants. Just jumping in and trying to swim will in all probability get you sick. Again, remember, we live in a world where Man thinks he is more clever than the Creator and nature and have started fiddling with things he has no business fiddling with. 100 years ago people could eat and drink anything they wanted without much hazard to their health. But today most commercially produces products are dangerous to the human health.

A simple, yet very effective motto I've adopted is "the longer a product's shelve life, the more hazardous to my health". I plant my own food and that which I can't plant, I only buy if I'm sure it was organically produced without any chemicals.
Who knew...? Who knows...? Who will ever know...? Well, it all depends on where you are standing....!
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Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:59 am

Thanks for the answer, Paul! :thumbup:

Well, what I can say is that our "diet change" included eating more chicken (mostly deboned skinless breasts) and going organic. We also have a veggie garden at home and mostly eat from there. Meat we almost never buy, as we have a farm where I know how the cattle and sheep are reared - 100% organic! What I can assure everybody is that the stuff you grow yourself tastes a million times better than the mass produced stuff we buy at the local supermarket.

Problem with all these Protein foods you mention is that I do not find most of them tasty. I eat them because I understand (sort of) their benefits, but can't say I'll steam myself a nice big bowl a Broccoli as a snack to watch the rugby... :twisted: Nuts and fruit is of course a different scenario, but I was under the impression fruit contains more carbs (natural sugar) than protein?

We are adventurous eaters and like spicy food - personally hate bland food! So is there a good website or cooking book you can recommend where we can start experimenting with our veggies and salad? I just can't currently imagine the idea of eating ONLY raw with no added tastes. However I am sure this is also only because I'm ignorant of what you can do with raw food in terms of spices, etc.

And don't worry guys, I'm not converting... yet! I just think that Paul has given us some food for thought and we all might benefit by incorporating some of his ideas into our diet. I can certainly attest to the fact that I have lost a serious amount of weight by just changing my diet slightly.

And thanks again Paul for not coming with the emotional mumbo jumbo that is normally associated with vegans/vegetarians, but rather interesting and logical statements. Your approach has certainly made me inquisitive! :thumbup:
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Thu Nov 15, 2012 1:32 pm

Johann, there are literally 100's of resources you can get info from. One such resource is what got me going. Here is the link;
http://www.amazon.com/Forks-Over-Knives ... 1615190457" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
There are many, many wonderful and delicious recipes at the back.

If you love hot and spicy half as much as I do, you will find this blog very entertaining;
http://thespicyvegan.blogspot.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Then there is 1000 Vegan Recipes by Robin Robertson, The Happy Herbivore by Lindsay S. Nixon, 175 Hot & Spicy Vegetarian Recipes by Beverley Jollands and many, many more. Just shout if you want more resources. You can also check out my wonderful friends' websites if you like;
My wonderful and sexy friend, Kristina Carrillo-Bucaram at http://www.fullyraw.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Mr. muscle man Billy Simmonds at http://www.vegetarianbodybuilding.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Lovely Carly Fraser at livelovefruit.com/blog/
Wonderful Trace Russel at http://www.incrediblesmoothies.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


But not to guide you "fanatically", simply google "spicy vegan recipes" and you'll find thousands of wonderful, delicious, mouthwatering healthy recipes to your taste.

Johann, not all fruit have the same characteristics, same as veggies, legumes, nuts, seeds etc. Each one is unique, which is why you must get to know their qualities. As you get to know them and your body, you can make informed choices as to what is best suited to your "unique physique" :D:
Individual protein needs depend on age, size, and activity level. The current standard method used by nutritionists to estimate our minimum daily protein requirement is body weight in kilograms times (x) 0.8. This is the number of grams of protein that should be the daily minimum (more or less). According to this method, a person weighing 68kg should eat at least 55 grams of protein per day, a 91kg person should get 74 grams, and a 113 person should eat 92 grams.
A rough guide would be;

½ cupTofu, 20 grams protein
Soy milk, 1 cup - 6 -10 grams
Most beans (black, pinto, lentils, etc) about 7-10 grams protein per half cup of cooked beans
Soy beans, ½ cup cooked – 14 grams protein
Split peas, ½ cup cooked – 8 grams
Peanut butter, 2 Tablespoons - 8 grams protein
Almonds, ¼ cup – 8 grams
Peanuts, ¼ cup – 9 grams
Cashews, ¼ cup – 5 grams
Pecans, ¼ cup – 2.5 grams
Sunflower seeds, ¼ cup – 6 grams
Pumpkin seeds, ¼ cup – 8 grams
Flax seeds – ¼ cup – 8 grams

Vegans and vegetarians eat more times per day, so it is easier to spread the protein intake (and anything else) more evenly throughout the day. This is a very effective way of supplying the body with a constant fuel source instead of having, let us say one big meal per day which boosts energy, but only for a short time.

Just to give you an example. I start my day with a smoothie. This can include anything that is enjoyable, tasty and available. Mostly this time of year mine includes oranges, papaya, banana, pears, apples, spinach, ginger and anything else I can put in there. Tastes differ greatly and so does the quantities and combos. I drink about 500ml of this at about 6:00am, 10:00am and then again at about 13:00pm. In between I might eat various fruits or salads or combos - depending on the weather and what I feel like. In the evening when we get home, and to keep the wife happy, we might steam potatoes, zucchini, carrots, mielies and/or whatever else is available. While she prefers hers steamed, I eat whatever I can raw.
One of my favorites is steamed potato with zucchini, cauliflower onions, broccoli, lots of apple cider vinegar and lots, and I mean LOTS of cayenne pepper over it all.

Last night we made a wonderful snack from ground fresh peanuts, carrot pulp (from juicing raw carrots) dates, coconut and banana. Of course I was in the dog box, because I just guzzled them down quicker than she could make them :o:

Anyway, the possibilities are basically endless and I promise you, it is not as dreary and drab as most would make it of to be. The only limit is your imagination.

Just some teasers if you might have a sweet tooth - one with a recipe;
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Chocolate Coconut Cream Torte.docx
(117.45 KiB) Downloaded 37 times
Who knew...? Who knows...? Who will ever know...? Well, it all depends on where you are standing....!
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Sat Nov 07, 2015 12:01 am

Hallo almal. Ek weet dat hierdie post het stil gestaan op Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:46 pm. Paar intersante stukke wat daar uitgekom het, soms warm. Laat ek eers vertel wat met my gebeur het en dan vertel ek hoekom ek hierdie post weer laat herlewe.
In die middel van die nag op die 4 November 2015 word ek wakker met 'n nood. Moet opstaan om 'n draai te loop en met die opstaan skiet daar een helse pyn dwarsoor my liggaam. Ek wil skree van die pyn maar hou my in sodat ek nie my vroulief wakker maak nie. Nou sit ek daar in die donkerte en wag dat die pyn moet weggaan. My asem weggeslaan en ek hyg na asem. Konsentreer hard om my lyf stil te kry, soekend na asem. Was dit paar sekonde of paar minute later, kan ek nie sê nie. Noudat ek weer my asem het en die pyn bedaar het, beweeg ek 'n tree verder. Daar ontplof my liggaam in een helse pyn en my asem weg. Soek hard om my asem weer te kry en wag dat die pyn moet bedaar. Nou ja, van my bed na die toilet is tien tree en met elke tree, skiet die pyn deur my liggaam en my asem skoonweg. Ek wil skree, maar wil nie my vrou wakker maak nie en ek moet toilet toe gaan. Dis of ek maak 'n plasie net daar en gaan terug bed toe. Nou ja, kom by die toilet uit en soos ek my broek afskuif, een helse pyn en en weg is die asem. Na vyf of ses probeerslae, kan nie onthou nie - helse pyn en weg is die asem met elke beweging, sit ek uiteindelik. Klaar water afgeslaan, met elke beweging en tree terug kamer toe was een lang helse pad om te loop met hierdie pyn wat onbeskryfbaar was. Seker maar 'n uur of twee later moet ek weer gaan, maar het nie kans gesien om hierdie pyn weer deur te gaan nie. Maak maar my vroutjie wakker en vra haar dat sy vir my die potjie moet bring. Sy bel die dokter vroegoggend en die sê ek moet maar kom. Gelukkig bly ek oorkant die hospitaal en die dokter se spreekkamer was ook daar. Soontoe loop kon ek nie. Vroulief gaan haal maar 'n rolstoel daar vir my. Weereens met elke beweging om op die rolstoel te kom, by die spreekkamer se ondersoekbed op te kom was een helse pyn. Ek het al baie pyne in my lewe gehad - bike ongeluk, brandwonde ens. maar hierdie is 'n pyn wat ek nie my grootse vaynd sal toewens nie. Ek is toe opgeneem en na behandelinge gister en vandag, is ek vandag ontslaan.

Nou waar het dit begin. Dit is jare se slegte en ongesonde eetgewoontes. Ek is 'n groot brood en vleis man. Waar daar brood is, moet daar vleis wees of waar daar vleis is, moet daar brood wees. Ek eet min groente en vrugte. Waar ek ookal mag gaan, moet daar koffie wees. As ek wakker word - koffie, as ek gaan slaap - koffie. As ek genooi word na 'n funksie, partytjie of whatever, almal het geweet daar moet koffie wees. Nou die beste van alles is, ek hou nie van water nie.

Dis nou toevallig dat ek Paul se post verlede week gelees het en hierdie week hel siek geraak het. Paul het verduidelik hoe belangerik is dit om jou Ph-vlak reg te hou. Dis nou, geen suurvlak te alle tye nie en neffens bokant die 7.5 alkalie wat gesond is. Ek het oor die jare altyd daardie steekpyne in my rug gehad wat ek toegeskryf het aan my motorfietsongeluk. Af en toe gaan sien ek 'n dokter, kry pille en voel dan beter of ek behandel myself en voel ook dan beter. Hierdie jaar gebeur dit met my driekeer en die laaste een was die kersie op die koek.

Nou die feite. Alle stysel en protiëne, enigiets wat suiker in het en kaffiëne het een ding in gemeen. Dit ontwater jou wat vir niks skrik nie. Vir een koppie koffie moet jy drie glase water drink om die nodige vog wat jou liggam nodig het, terug te kry. En so ook met die ander goed, vir elke iets wat jy inneem, moet jy soveel te meer water drink. Nou soos ek die post wat Paul begin het, lees soos dit vorder, sien ek die manne wat hou van hulle vleisie en doppies (word van suiker gemaak). Ek dink nie dat ek sommer 'n vegan sal word nie. Ek sal nou maar net sorg dat ek 'n gebalanseerde dieët volg waar my Ph-vlak net duskant die 7.5 gaan wees.

Ons word ouer en as ons nie na ons self kyk nie, dan huil ons lang trane. Ek het die laaste paar jare paar goed in my dieët ingebring om my gesond te hou. Dit is nou MMS en 35% foodgrade hydrogen peroxide. Nou die twee produkte werk, waar daar enigiets van kieme, virusse, bakterie en swamme betrokke is. Kan vir julle talle stories daaroor vertel, ons los dit vir anderdag. Wat ek nie gereken het nie, is kristalle wat in jou niere ontwikkel. Die berugte NIERSTENE. Ek het dit net gekry agv my ongesonde en swak eetgewoontes. Jammer dat ek nou so 'n lang ding opgesit het, maar net gedink dat as daar ander mense is wat nie reg eet en drink nie, net hierdie gevaarteken vroegtydig moet sien want nierstene is hel.

Groete tot dan
Ecc 1:9 Wat gewees het, dit sal daar weer wees; en wat gebeur het, dit sal weer gebeur, en daar is glad niks nuuts onder die son nie.
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Sat Nov 07, 2015 10:19 am

Sjoe Hennie, jammer om te hoor maar ken daai storie al te goed - was al so 7 / 8 keer (onthou nie meer presies nie) in soortgelyke omstandighede (hospitaal) maar nog baie meer waar ek genoeg vroëer waarskuwing gehad het dat ek nog self behandeling kon doen.

Ai, daardie pyn! Hulle sê dis die naaste aan wat 'n man kan kom om die geboortepyn van 'n vrou te kan ervaar. Onthou een keer (uit so drie of vier) toe dit met my by die werk gebeur het - ry toe hospitaal toe maar het dit nie gemaak nie - moes van die pad af trek en net genoeg tyd gehad om die deur oop te maak om the kots van die pyn, my broer te bel en sê waar ek staan en die deure te sluit voor ek bewussing verloer het.

Drink self te veel koffie en te min water!

Gelukkig het ek 'n hele paar doktor en apteker vriende wat help dat ek 'n vooraad 'Buscopan' en sterk verdowings middel by die huis aanhou. As ek voel daar is 'n probleem dan vat ek die goed soos aangedui en drink water dat ek nie meer kan nie vir so twee of drie dae en die stene word uit 'ge-flush'.

Bly om te hoor jy voel nou darem beter, maar wees bereid, dit sal nog weer gebeur. :D: :winkx:
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Sat Nov 07, 2015 1:22 pm

Hallo Andy. Wat intersant is, ek het vir jare Apple Cider Vinager (ACV) gedrink sommer so uit die bottel uit. Kombucha tee gedrink. Cyane pepper gedrink met water. Onbewustelik het ek hierdie goed gedrink sonder om te weet dat dit die beste ding is wat ek kon doen. Dit het my Ph-vlak reggehou wat dan veroorsaak het dat ek nooit nierstene gekry het ongeag my slegte of ongesonde dieët. Nierstene hou nie van goeie Ph-vlak nie.
Wat het dan verander. Ek het in twee jaar agtermekaar tweekeer in die hospitaal beland avg longontsteking. Het toe bietjie navorsing gedoen en op MMS en 35% foodgrade hydrogen peroxide (H2O) afgekom. Wat gebeur nou, gebruik net MMS en H2O en beland nie weer in die hospitaal vir die laaste 6 jaar nie. Dit is waar die popo die fan tref. Ek drink nou nie meer ACV, kombucha tee en cyane pepper nie. Nou kry my liggaam die kans om die gevreesde stene op te bou oor paar jare wat toe Woensdag deurgebars het.
Een ding is seker, ek is nie so dapper om nog 'n keer deur daardie hel te gaan nie. So, ek gaan nou alles wat ek genoem het gebruik.
Apple Cider Vinager (ACV), Kombucha tee en Cyane pepper om my Ph-vlak reg te hou met gebalanseerde dieët.
MMS en H2O om al die goggas weg te hou. Goggas wat ek hier van praat is - griep, verkoue, diareë. Ek het eenkeer vir iemand MMS gegee wat Aids gehad het en hy is genees daarvan. Mense wat malaria kry is genees daarvan. Ons honde is genees van Parvo (katgriep) nadat ek een verloor het deur die onkunde van die veearts. Mense wat H2O drink se Altzheimer gaan weg. Kanker gaan weg. Ek het een broer verloor deur kanker want hy wou nie glo dat die twee - MMS en H2O kanker gaan wegvat nie.
Praat dan weer later.
Ecc 1:9 Wat gewees het, dit sal daar weer wees; en wat gebeur het, dit sal weer gebeur, en daar is glad niks nuuts onder die son nie.
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Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:06 am

Koos wat is die MMS waarna jy verwys?
Aint it ironic that "Common Sense" aint so common after all...
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Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:20 am

Hallo Shane.
MMS staan vir Miracle Mineral Supplement en is uitgevind deur John Humble, 'n Amerikaner. Jy kan sy boek in PDF formaat verniet aflaai op die Internet. As jy nie regkom nie, PM my, dan sal ek vir jou 'n kopie stuur. Dis regtig die moeite werd om dit te lees en ook die MMS in jou huis te hê.
Groete tot dan
Ecc 1:9 Wat gewees het, dit sal daar weer wees; en wat gebeur het, dit sal weer gebeur, en daar is glad niks nuuts onder die son nie.
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Sun Nov 08, 2015 9:17 am

My buurman het ook elke paar jaar nierstene ...

Sy dieet wek geen alarms, sekerlik nie die gesondste nie, maar beslis ook nie buitensporig nie.


koffie, koffie, en dan sommer nog BAIE koffie ..... (en BAIE suiker in elke koppie)




ek is die laaste paar jaar van een koppie koffie per dag stelselmatig tot so 4 koppies per dag .... julle sal maak dat ek weer meer tee drink.
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