1995 SFA Fuel Warning Light

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Tim86
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Fri Sep 21, 2018 1:42 pm

Hi guys

For the 90's models sfa's is the low fuel warning indicator meant to glow when the level nears empty?
Please see pic below - the gauge needle has edged below the empty mark yet still no light from the indicator.
IMG_20180921_131046.jpg
Last edited by Tim86 on Tue Sep 25, 2018 10:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Mud Dog
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Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:14 pm

None of my SFA's had a low fuel warning indicator ..... or at least not one that I knew about. :winkx:
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Tim86
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Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:18 pm

:thumbup: :thumbup:
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niclemaitre
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Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:48 pm

Ya, no light. I tend to drive on the odo rather than the gauge, since the gauge in mine shows empty with about 10l left.
Happy trails
Nic

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Tim86
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Fri Sep 21, 2018 4:36 pm

So how many km's do you need on your odo before you fill up Nic;) and what motor?
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Tue Sep 25, 2018 8:26 am

It's a 50l tank and I get around 480-500km out of that. I usually fill at about 450. The 2.8 (3L) donkey diesel engine
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Tim86
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Tue Sep 25, 2018 8:30 am

Jeez that's pretty good going there Nic. Have pushed mine and it is also still running with the gauge way past empty!
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Tue Sep 25, 2018 8:52 am

Typically there will still be about 15 lit reserve from where the gauge hits the E mark.
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Tim86
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Tue Sep 25, 2018 8:58 am

Alrighty, that's good to know. I nearly got a heart attack when the odo read 250km's and the gauge hit empty:/
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Tue Sep 25, 2018 12:12 pm

I've done some experimentation on how far you can drive on empty with mine, with a full jerry can to get me home once I run out.

On my previous SFA with the 22R engine, I did 140km past empty before I ran out of nerve and filled up from the jerry.

The easier way to do it (no risk of having to bleed the system) is wait until it hits E on the gauge and then siphon the tank to see how much is there
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Tue Sep 25, 2018 1:10 pm

The "system" should "bleed" in a very short time .... maybe 3 or 4 three second cranks ...... that's with the standard mechanical pump in good condition. If you have an electric pump fitted it's practically immediate, ... with the key in the IGN position, just listen to the pump clicking away for short while and then it will slow down ... that's when the float chamber is full.

Alternatively (with a mechanical pump) you can keep a cap full or two of fuel aside after filling the tank and toss that down the throat of the carb, like a teaspoon full at a time ...or feed it in while someone cranks for you. It's so easy to remove the intake from the carb (one wing-nut) that it's the way I would go rather than strain the battery and starter. By the time that fuel is used the pump should have caught up and the motor "running on it's own".

If you're lucky enough to be facing a downhill, let the vehicle get rolling and then engage 3rd or 4th with the ignition on. Should fire up pretty quickly.
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
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Tim86
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Tue Sep 25, 2018 1:53 pm

I have just done the 'run to empty and jerry refill' right now and got 298 km's on a 65 L full tank. Under reading due to 33's, mixed use driving but still very poor economy. Adjusted the timing about 50 km's ago and it was previously about 2-3 degrees too advanced. How much of a reduction in fuel economy would you guys estimate this off timing would have made?
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Tue Sep 25, 2018 4:01 pm

Depends on how much of it was on the open road. Highway speeds will have the motor revving at about 3200 rpm and a slightly advanced timing will benefit power and fuel economy, whereas urban driving,(a lot of which is low revs) would benefit from a slightly retarded timing.

What motor is it and where is the timing set now? ( ° BTDC)
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
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Tim86
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Tue Sep 25, 2018 4:18 pm

About 150km's was open road. Is the advance not meant to perform that function or does it not do it effectively enough?

22R with Brospeed exhaust system, cam and applicable sparkies - set at 8 deg btdc on the dot with 2X vacuum advance lines blocked as per the replacement Brospeed sticker on the hood.
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Wed Sep 26, 2018 12:18 am

8° BTDC doesn't sound too wild given that the OEM spec is 5° (with vacuum advance)
The longer duration cams also like a little more advanced timing so I think you should leave it there but you might want to try reconnecting the vacuum advance. At revs the motor should go as far as about 23° BTDC with the advance and you're now not getting that benefit.

I replaced my 22R's long duration cam with a standard one .... there just wasn't enough low end, not for general town driving and certainly not for trails. Even on the open road the motor only seemed to start waking up from about 3000RPM ..... felt sluggish up to about 120kmph but once it got past 130 it would climb to 160 / 170 with ease. The motor would happily rev up to 6000rpm with a blip of the pedal, but despite all that it just wasn't cutting it for general use. I got much more low end now so I don't have to work on revs which in turn saves fuel and the motor itself. Admittedly it's not as lively on the open road and although there's not too much of a problem maintaining 120 kmph, it just drops off when pushing it further and although it was great for overtaking, you can't legally drive at those speeds anyway.

The guys with the white lab coats and coke-bottle glasses at Toyota designed the standard cam for all round benefit and compromise, although I think the 22R is a motor that would have benefited greatly with a VVT system.
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
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Tim86
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Wed Sep 26, 2018 7:12 am

Apologies for the misunderstanding - I only disconnected and blocked the vacuum lines when timing the motor in the garage at Brospeed specified idle of 950rpm. Vacuum lines most definitely reconnected after that!

I will keep the standard cam replacement in mind for the future, although now I think of it we do have a few more dunes down here in die Kaap;)

I was just interested in if (and hoping that) a few degrees off the correct timing (whatever it may be) would have a noticeably negative effect on fuel economy.
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Wed Sep 26, 2018 8:05 am

Keep the cam for dune chasing. :winkx:
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
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Wed Sep 26, 2018 12:01 pm

Is there a way to identify the Brospeed cam?
I have bought my vehicle (22R) with the Brospeed exhaust manifold - but there is no additional timing sticker under the hood except the original one of 5° I suspect it has the original cam - as low down torque (trails and in town driving) is good.
What I do struggle with is maintaining 120km/h. Slight uphill and I lose all momentum. Also as soon as the engine starts to labour it pings a lot. Even with gearing down and keeping te revs up it will ping when getting worked. I have played with the timing a little in each direction but does not solve the problem. Both vacuum tubes to the dizzy do work as well.
Any idea what else I can look at? Does the 22R have different carb jetting for Gauteng vs Sealevel?
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Wed Sep 26, 2018 12:43 pm

After market cams are (usually) stamped or engraved with the duration and lift on the rear end of the cam. You would have to use a mirror but even then it's very difficult to see nicely. However, from what you say I also strongly suspect that it's still standard.

Pinging usually suggests an ignition timing problem or mixture being too lean. Using a higher octane fuel sometimes solves that but I think you guys only get 93 up your way. Perhaps checking the jets and doing a dyno would be the way to go.
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
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Wed Sep 26, 2018 12:56 pm

Thanks MD
Here is a few garages selling 95 octane. I will give that a go over the weekend.
I will report back with maybe it's own tread.
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Tim86
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Wed Sep 26, 2018 12:59 pm

Are you 100% sure its pinging Martin? The 4Y and 22R motors do seem to generally have a slight "bzzz" to their exhaust notes which may be mistaken as pinging (at least to my ear). I found that it originates from around the exhaust manifold. More of a leak in the exhaust type of sound. Maybe retard the timing quite a bit, say to 0 deg btdc and go for a spin. Also check float level.
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Wed Sep 26, 2018 1:15 pm

I'm pretty sure - but will try and take a Video - it's very pronounced and sounds like loud metal clapping sounds, almost like the rings are rattling (best I can describe it). The Buzz sound is there but doesn't bother at all.
What I have noticed is there is less of a pinging noise when running Total fuel as opposed to Sasol, both close to my house (But this may be totally just in my head... hahaha)

The float level is just below the middle line (very slightly)
It does drain away over night - so in the morning a few cranks to start.

I'll try the 0 deg as well and see what happens
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Tim86
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Wed Sep 26, 2018 1:45 pm

Alrighty.

Hahaha!

Maybe adjust the float temporarily to above the centreline to eliminate the possibility of it being too lean as stated by Andy.

I also have the exact same drain away problem - Andy do you have any recommendation on the possible cause(s) of this? I have spoken to the main carby chap here in CT and he was very unspecific and said it could be a number of things (old seals etc.) but I would appreciate a more specific answer so I can diagnose and sort it myself. If the fuel in the bowl drains back into the lines then not a problem but if it goes into the manifold then it is quite a waste of fuel on a daily basis.
Last edited by Tim86 on Wed Sep 26, 2018 4:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Wed Sep 26, 2018 2:47 pm

Martin, syphon the fuel out as much as you can before filling 95 octane.

Float level should be on the centre line mark when the vehicle stands level, not above and not below. Tweak it very gently, a small bend in the float arm gives a big level difference.

The draining away of fuel is something that also puzzles me - it should not be able to drain at all. Perhaps it's evaporating rather than draining. Some carbs have a float chamber drain screw - if it has, the seal may be leaking. Also look around the carb for the tell-tale signs that there is fuel leaking. Look closely for leaks at/ around the acceleration pump on the side. If it evaporates, then the upper gasket on the carb might be buggered. :think:
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
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