Holrug geryde D4D 2x4 na D4D 4x4 conversion

Discuss modifications on your new shape Hilux here. 2005 till current. Also called the Vigo in other countries.
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Montie
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More mane en manninne, /guys and gals

Ek begin net met dag se en groet. :bye: Ek is nuut op die blad maar met 'n ou kwessie soos die titel aandui. Caveat, en ek weeettt; verkoop jou 2x4 en koop 'n 4x4, moeite, kostes, lisensies, herverkoop, blah, blah, blah. Daar verby, dit gaan nie gebeur nie, die beste opsie wat ek kon kry, was R35K duurder, 2 jaar ouer as my bakkie, 100k meer kilo's op, geen mens weet die hoeveelste eienaar met geen agtergrond kennis, nee wat!

Voordele en ek is nie windgat nie, ek was/is 'n mechanic (aircraft), omskakelings al van appie dae af, dus eerste kar al gebou in 1980 (T-Bucket met 289 motor, Jag diff ...., geruil vir 'n Cortina bakkie met 'n Rover V8 (SIES, GA!!!) motor in, uitgesmyt en 351 Cleveland ingebou-- (eers met 'n Toploader box en Jag rear Suspension wat nie kon nie vrag dra nie, toe uitgegooi ten gunste van Ranchero diff, toe 5 spoed Getrag ingebou. Volgende projek was 'n Cobra, eers met 'n 351Windsor en FMX auto box met Jag rear, Windsor uitgehaal ten gunste van 'n Fairmont GT motor, ,nou gekoppel aan 'n Getrag ratkas (die keer uit 'n 328 BMW, huidige projekkie, KCC GT40. Ek het ook 'n staal / sheetmetal "werkwinkel " by my huis, ek kan tinker, weld , verf, rond cough en al daai nommers.

Grootste voordeel, hier is manne soos julle, met ondervinding soos navorsing op blad reeds gewys het!! Hier is manne soos Bennie, Marnus en ander, waarop ek graag op sal wil leun vir raad, asseblief.

Nadeel, ek het nie geld om uit te gee nie, (2 skeisake later) dus die R35k prys verskil is my teiken en daarna ek het nog my eie bakkie! 'N man versaak mos nie sy voertuig waarmee hy "gebond" het nie!

Dus, Avante!! NO RETREAT!!

My plan met die (4x4) bakkie? Ek wil nie berge en slote ry nie, ek soek 'n funksionele 4x4, ek soek die rat verhouding om met 'n vrag te kan weg trek ( ek moes al my clutch ruil..2keer...vanwee te swaar vrag te wil sleep ), en dan maar overlanding, sonder om oorboord te gaan. Geensins 'n geval van myne is beter/ groter/ sterker nie.

Die kandidaat is 'n Toyota, 'n 2x4, 2010, D/C Raised Body 3.0 D4D, dus reeds 'n 4x4 volgens oplees werk, maar sonder die 4x4. Ek het reeds die regte ratkas gekry, dus R35 minus R7k, beide splinter nuwe propshafts, minus nog R6k.

My grootste struikelblok blyk die voorste diff te wees, volgens al die navorsing is daar met Toyota se diffs in Babelse verwarring tussen ratios, part nommers, selfs publikasies verskil oor dieselfde goed, verskillende modelle met verskillende ratverhoudings... Die laaste ding wat ek wil doen is om die "regte" voor diff te koop met die verkeerde ratverhouding want, dan sink my geld-spaar skippie...

Ek het 'n tabel raakgeloop gehad met die verskillende modelle Toyota bakkies se diff ratio's, DC, singel cabs, "plat" en Raised, 2x4 en 4x4, maar weens grys hare nie gesave nie en verloor, tot my bittere spyt. Ek krap al geruime tyd weer daarvoor maar wat wou! Ontwyk my soos daai trofee koedoe!

Nou ja, genoeg vir eers, as julle kan help met so 'n tabel of raad, GROOT Asseblief
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Mud Dog
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Welkom Monty! :thumbup:

Geluk met die projek. Lyk my jy is heeltemal toegevoer daarvoor, maar ja, daai diff ratios ... sal ook 'n oog oop hou vir so 'n tabel waarvan jy praat. Het Google niks gelewer nie?
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
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Dowe Koos
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Ecc 1:9 Wat gewees het, dit sal daar weer wees; en wat gebeur het, dit sal weer gebeur, en daar is glad niks nuuts onder die son nie.
Montie
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Baie dankie Mud Dog en Koos!!! Ja, ek het tannie Google gevra en weer gevra, maar daai tabelletjie bly my ontwyk. Baie dankie vir die skakels, Dowe Koos, ek het van dit al gesien en ek sal deur die nuwes ook werk.

Uiteindelik is hierdie die kern van die probleem en die oplossing daarvoor dit: ek met die selfde ratio voordiff kry as my huidige agter diff, ek wil nie graag nog twee diffs koop en die huidige een is 100% nie! Die Toyota se eie boekie is nie veel werd wat die ratios aan betref nie, ek sal dus maar die VIN nommer gebruik om die huidig ratio te bepaal volgens die gegooglde VIN ontsluitings kode.

Dan is daar natuurlik die "Red-Neck" manier om die een wiel op te jack, die wiel en die propshaft te merk en elkeen se aantal draai te tel, maal en deel. Dit sal ek egter gebruik as bevestiging van dit wat die ViN nommer se.
Montie
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The plot thickens! A post from Family Dog, circa 2014/05/05, 07:14 PM #2 is the closest thing to the 2005 onward gear chart, so, for my model 2010 3.0 D4D Raised Body 2x4, from the list the diff ratio supposedly is 4,875, although the list pertinently states 1999 series:
"Presumably the 2004 version uses the same diff as a 1999 IFS model...

Hilux Diff Ratios 1999 Series According to my brochure on the first IFS models, the following details are provided:

DOUBLE CAB:
2700i LWB 4x4 Raider: 4.556
3000D LWB 4x4 Raider: 4.875
3000D LWB 4x2 raised Body Raider: 4.875
2700i LWB 4x4 SRX: 4.556
2000 LWB 4x2 SR: 4.111

SINGLE CAB 4x4 & 4x2 RAISED BODY:
2700i LWB 4x4 R/B Raider: 4.556
2700i LWB 4x4 Raider: 4.556
3000D LWB 4x2 R/B Raider: 4.875
2700i LWB 4x4: 4.556
3000D LWB 4x4: 4.556
3000D LWB 4x2 R/B: 4.556

SINGLE CAB 4x2
2000 LWB 4x2 SR: 4.111
2000 LWB 4x2: 4.111
2400D LWB 4x2: 4.111
2400D SWB 4x2: 4.111
1800 SWB 4x2: 4.556

For what it's worth, my one Raider (Hound Dog) had two different diffs fitted when I bought it. It was easier & cheaper to replace the rear diff (4.556) than the front diff (4.875) so both diffs are now 4.875 even tho' it's a petrol model 2700i.

-F_D "

From the VIN plate, the A/TM code states "B04" which decodes into 4,56 ratio with 2 carrier pinion and LSD (Electric diff lock?) I still have to do the "Red-Neck" check to confirm. Anybody else has info on this perhaps?
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Monty, I recall someone once saying that the ratios are externally marked on the diff housing. However, even if that is the case one cant be sure if a previous owner has changed the crown and pinion and altered the ratio (that is to say, if you are not the first owner).

If the diff is a local diff (Gearmax), then it's easy enough to remove the cover plate and count the teeth on the crown and on the pinion, which will give you the ratio. However, if it's the import diff there is no removable cover plate since it's a "third member" type diff and one has to pull the half shafts and remove the prop-shaft in order to get the diff out.
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
Montie
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Thanks Mud Dog, I also heard that the specs are on the diff with a marking plate or sticker, so I crawled under and took some pics, well, still greek to me... now on the forum, how do one upload pics?
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Real Name: Andy
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Pics .... If you are creating a thread you will automatically be in the "Full Editor" window, but if replying to a post you have to select "Full Editor" by scrolling down a bit (i.e. don't use the "Quick Reply" box).

In "Full Editor" you can attach pics. To do so your pics have to first be resized to a max of 800x600 Pixels - scoll down past the text box in full editor and click on "Attachments" then "Add Files" - locate your pic files in the small explorer box that appears - double click or click / open and the file uploads. You can select multiple files (up to five if I recall) at a time.

The pics will appear at the bottom of your text after you submit your post unless you use the "Place in line" function which allows you to place pics at different points in your text. To do this first upload your pics and then place your cursor where you want the pic to appear within your text body (in the text box) - scroll down to the uploaded files, select the desired file to be place and click "Place in line". Walla! :D: :winkx:
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
Montie
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Thank you Mud Dog, I will give it a go tomorrow!
Montie
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"Let the games begin!!" Well, it began! I moved the conversation here form "Clutch Problems" so as not to hijack the post.

I am already in the process of removing the 2x4 gearbox and will be able to make a side-by-side comparison of the two boxes once alongside each other. I already have the Sachs clutch kit (purchased a while ago), so that can also be used for comparative purposes. As quick and dirty check, I now phoned one of the local parts suppliers, the same part number is listed for both the 3.0 Vigo 2x4 and 4x4 clutch, it even has the same number as for the 3.0 KZ TE clutch. :D:

Incidentally, I recovered a 10 ton trolley jack from a local scrap metal yard last week (( all it needed was a bit of oil and now again working like new!) thus with an impromptu made-up gearbox cradle, the removal and installation of the two gearboxes should be a breeze.... (I hope!) because this jack has more than sufficient lift. Note, I will be doing the swop on the ground, although I do have a 4Post Lift in the garage.... I am not Schwarzenegger and doing this by myself without help.... so lifting from the ground to above the head is out!
20210102_120341.jpg
Montie
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Well, after a struggle, the 2x4 box is out... Dang gear lever!!! So in afterthought, there is no way I will be able to fit the 4x4 gearbox without removing the gear-levers. Not having a proper Vigo manual, I checked the Prado manual that I found online and Gear Lever removal... it is a piece of pie!! The Prado gearbox seems very similar to the Vigo box and yes, the gear-levers are removed in the same way!! It really is a breeze!!
Gear lever removal.jpg
Montie
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Two gearboxes aligned for comparison: Looks like it will have to be a custom cross member that I need to manufacture since I do not want to butcher the existing one. The tail shafts are the same height, so there is no requirement for adjusting the diff angle.
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Washed and ready
washed and ready resized.jpg
How easy it is to remove the gear lever, if ONLY one had access to a manual beforehand!
Removing gearlevers resized.jpg
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Montie, your projects are providing excellent reading material, your manner of writing also entices the reader to follow these with keen interest. Thank you for this, please keep it up! :thumbsup:


-F_D
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White Fang: 1999 2.7i DC Raider 4x4
Bull Dog: 1987 4Y-EFI 2.2 DC 4x4
Pra Dog: 1998 Prado VX 3.4
Hound Dog: 2000 2.7i SC 4x4


One Staffie, One Jack Russell, One Ring Neck Screecher, 17 Fish of questionable heritage


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Montie
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Thank you, sir, you make me blush!
Montie
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Up date on progress, pics from this morning. New thrust bearing installed
20210104_122722.jpg
New Sachs clutch in place, aligned and bolted up
20210104_122815.jpg
Straps inserted through the gearlever aperture, I would not like this lot to fall on me once we huff and puff to get things aligned
20210104_122736.jpg
QC checking on progress, and safety
20210104_124726.jpg
Gearbox bolted on, and tailend supported now for manufacturing the new crossmember, scrapyard, I am on my way!
20210104_124808.jpg
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Hopefully the standard 4x4 model X-member will be a straight forward bolt-on job. At worst you might have to make some new holes in the chassis. Holding thumbs! :winkx:
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.

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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
Montie
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Decided upfront to circumvent the frustration to source a 4x4 cross-member during this silly season time, I opted to fabricate my own version. Not difficult, it just took some time. I ensured that the gearbox output flange height is on the original lateral line, thus ensuring alignment with the diff and not to induce undue stress on the universals.
20210105_160431.jpg
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20210107_110159.jpg
Bummer when wanting to install the propshaft, the 4x4 propshaft center bearing banger is behind the center bearing cross member! So, had to whip up new hangers, and not cutting off the old ones. Now for final welding, painting and assembly!
20210107_110056.jpg
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You make it look so easy, Montie. And here at home I battled for 3 weeks to replace a braided water hose to the toilet cistern, damn thing kept leaking where it screwed onto the galvanised pipe nipple. Still drips a little but very slowly now.


-F_D
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White Fang: 1999 2.7i DC Raider 4x4
Bull Dog: 1987 4Y-EFI 2.2 DC 4x4
Pra Dog: 1998 Prado VX 3.4
Hound Dog: 2000 2.7i SC 4x4


One Staffie, One Jack Russell, One Ring Neck Screecher, 17 Fish of questionable heritage


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Montie
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Family_Dog wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 8:43 pm You make it look so easy, Montie. And here at home I battled for 3 weeks to replace a braided water hose to the toilet cistern, damn thing kept leaking where it screwed onto the galvanised pipe nipple. Still drips a little but very slowly now.


-F_D
Thanks meneer! Maybe a tip, replace the galvanized nipple with a brass version, the finishing is much better and you can face it a little to form a little flat surface for the rubber to seal against. If you do that with the galvanized version, it will last a while but corrosion will catch-up pretty soon.
Montie
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Rain kept me away all day yesterday, so got back to work this morning under the truck. Everything went well but assumption once again caught up with me! The 4x4 gearbox mounting holes are wider apart than the 2x4 version, fortunately the milling machine saved the day! Now it is just servicing the gearbox, bleeding the clutch... ( my wife bought me 3 BIG syringes to help with this), installing the gear-levers and gear-lever trim... still needs to be made ant then it is testing time. The front diff installation has to wait until I have sourced the correct ratio.
Friday.jpg
Note: the cat was also dumped and a straight piece of 2mm wall thickness 60mm diameter pipe fitted, perhaps improved on the fuel consumption or at least keep it the same as the 2x4 version (11,3Km per liter, running mostly highway and speed control set at 128kmh (GPS)
20210107_110159.jpg
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Ja, die Kz en eerste D4D's gebruik dieselfde 260mm clutch.

Praat met Barrie by Ultimate 4x4 vir die regte crossmember en ook voor diff.
'02 KZ 'Lux. Cooled. Chipped. Onca'd. Cherished!

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If you aren't raising your hand, raise your standards!

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Montie
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Dankie Thabo, dis die tipe inligting waarna ek soek, ek dink ek het gewen met die gearbox crossmember en het dit stewig gebou vir ingeval van obstacles Klippe raakry. My grootste uitdaging is nou fondse en dan die voordiff met dit wat daarmee saamgaan, klaarblyklik ook 'n 4x4 ECU.
Montie
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Nou ja, almal, dis nou amper 5 maande dat ek met die bakkie ry. Voorste diff met side shaft en hubs is reeds gekoop maar nog nie ingebou nie.
Terugvoer oor die ombouing, dis een mase plesier om nou low range te he, al is dit net twee wiel dryf. Twee goed wat uitstaan:
1. Die engine revs is heelwat laer vir dieselfde GPS spoed,
2. Brandstof verbruik het nie verbeter nie inteendeel, heelwat versleg, na 5000km lees die gemiddelde gebruik nou eers 10km per liter waard it voorheen beter as 11km per liter was, en die voorste dif is nog nie eens in nie.

Dalk moet ek die enjin laat stel (as dit moontlik is) omdat ek die CAT uit gehaal het? Met die verlaagde revolusies, het ek 'n verbetering in brandstof gebruik verwag?
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Montie geluk met die projek!

Ek is geensins 'n kenner op die D4D maar pelle van my praat van 'n brandstof verbruik van 7km/l.

'n "Remap" sal dalk nie 'n slegte opsie wees nie. Soos ek verstaan, as daar minder weerstand aan die uitlaat kant is (cat's uitgehaal) kan dit daartoe ly dat die turbo "overspool".

Ek kan nie se dat bg wel die geval is nie - net iets wat ek erns gehoor/gelees het.

Sterkte en hou ons op hoogte.

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Aint it ironic that "Common Sense" aint so common after all...
Montie
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Baie dankie vir die raad, ek sal moet werk maak hiervan, voordat daar onnodig geld gespandeer moet word
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Montie soos ek gese het, ek is glad nie 'n boffin nie. Net gedeel wat ek al raakgeloop het.

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Aint it ironic that "Common Sense" aint so common after all...
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Hallo Monty

Dit lyk sommer baie goed. Geluk man. Die D4D het nie CATs in nie. Hy het ‘n DPF (diesel particulate filter) in wat geen verskil kan maak aan die enjin verstellings nie. Ook nie aan die turbo nie. Ek het ‘n 2005 model gehad. Die eerste modelle het glad nie ‘n DPF gehad nie. Ek onthou ek het nog die een dag onder ingekruip om te kyk wat dit sou vat om dit uit te haal toe is daar geen DPF nie. Ek het die bakkie 317 000 kilos gery en rekord gehou van elke liter diesel wat ingegooi is. Ek het ‘n gemiddeld van 9.8 km/liter gekry in totaal. Baie manne sal met my verskil maar ek is glad nie ‘n voorstaander van ‘n “remap” nie. Ek wil die enjin terug na standaard kan vat sonder ‘n gesukkel. ‘n Dastek chip wat spesifiek vir jou enjin ingestel is, is ‘n beter opsie as jy daardie roete wil gaan.

Onthou wielgrootte maak ook ‘n groot verskil op verbruik maar ek neem aan jy het dieselfde bande gehou.
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